# Dog food



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

anyone know where i could buy wholesale dog food?

we go through 4 bags a month of 50 pounds.. 

Thanks..


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## beN (Apr 21, 2010)

4 bags !how many dogs do you have?


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

There's very little markup on dog food. Doubt too many places will give you wholesale when they make such a small margin. Also usually you need to order 600.00 minimum.

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275165,-122.835528


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

I'm not sure about wholesale, but if you find a local pet store you may be able to make a deal with them on pre-buying large quantities of good quality food. You may also look into shopping across the border or doing your own dog food...if you're buying 4 bags a week of good quality stuff, homemade starts to look pretty good in comparison. Organic World in Maple Ridge has really good prices on pet food, and a lot of butchers will give you deals on stuff like organ meats and ground food.

Keep in mind that a lot of the big name brands like Iams and the stuff they sell at supermarkets are complete crap and can lead to a lot of issues (like the pet food recall), and if you're feeding the puppies and getting them ready to sell, you want them as healthy as possible.

If you have a preferred brand, contact the company directly and ask. We've had excellent results with feeding Orijen and Acana to our dog as well as homemade food on occasion.


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

i would buy 600 no problem.. i usually sit 20 bags at home and its done in matter of months..

Elle, i m looking for food like natural balance, which is what the adult dogs are eating and innova puppy food for the puppies.

i also thought about going raw feeding, but havent really learned how to yet..
as i hearing all different kinds of opinions from people all over the internet.
some say it would cause parasites and some say its all good, doesnt matter
and then it comes down to what kind of meat and if its got to be frozen then thawed.


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

Now by petcurean is good or Orijen. I'd go grain free as so many dogs have allergies to wheat and corn etc. Also alot of junk that sounds good...like beet pulp, brewers yeast instead of whole rice, etc. bad preservatives that cause liver cancer.
Go to rate your dog food website and see which are the top brands.
Now and go is Canadian and they use all their fruits and vegetables from chilliwack area. All human grade ingredients.
I can see if I can give you a price for bulk. I have to put an orde in for myself for the shop very soon.
I can get natural balance. 
I'd have to have prepayment so I can order. 
Making your own dog food you need a proper balance of muscle, bone etc. I've seen alot of very fat soft flabby dogs over the years who were fed hamburger etc. they don't live long.
Alot of small dogs end up with cushings disease . More than I've ever seen. I'd say almost every second small dog we groom get diagnosed with it as they get older. Why? Not sure..maybe cause the vets are looking for it and testing for it. Or the food? Vaccinations etc..preservatives? Who knows.

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275018,-122.835495


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

hmmm, so april what would you think i should switch them over to?
as one of my dog do have allergies towards certain ingredients, but i have no idea what it is.
and i dont want to feed my dogs all different types of food, i d rather stick with one and feed them all the same


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

Well natural balance is good..what kinds of dogs do you have?
My poodles I gauge as they get runny eyes if grains or something in there that bothers them. Soft treats, etc. I keep them on now or Orijen grain free and clean eyes. My other Half gave his poodle zukes glucosamine soft treat at Xmas and right away runny stained eyes. So he's our indicator dog. I tried blue buffalo. Meant to be healthy and right away stained eyes. So I stick to what I know works. But natural balance is high up on top 10. I looked.
I can check prices and let you know when you decide what kind.

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275032,-122.835504


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

pitbulls and westies 
so yeah if you could let me know the prices on natural balance that would be great.. or even a list if you dont mind..

taste of the wild 
orijen
natural balance
innova
evo

these are food that i think are much better imo


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

We had one little dog who had really bad skin. They switched to now grain free and his skin is great now. No more bad skin and no ear infections

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275081,-122.835494


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## taureandragon76 (Apr 21, 2010)

+1 for orijen


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

April said:


> We had one little dog who had really bad skin. They switched to now grain free and his skin is great now. No more bad skin and no ear infections
> 
> ---
> I am here: Google Maps


any chance you know which ones are grain free?

Thanks April


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## Rastapus (Apr 21, 2010)

As April stated, the margin on dog food is slim to none. The only variable in price reflects the quality. We only carry Acana and Orijen, two of the world's best foods. Even if you manage to get wholesale pricing which is difficult even with stores due to territory rules, the difference will be squat. We can do a little on those two brands but support April, she was first on point. Just don't expect any pricing miracles.


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## beN (Apr 21, 2010)

The Acana line is awesome, I go with the fish based diet for my pups. Especially how my lab x portuguese water dog is allergic to chicken. So my Dogo gets the same.


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

Markup on dog food is less than 30%, chances of finding stores that will give you wholesale pricing are slim.

Inova & Evo were involved in a recall last year. We were feeding our guys Orijen 6 fish because Gambit has allergies to certain meats, chicken especially. Now we've got them on raw & loving his non-flakey skin  A lot of our friends with 50 - 80 lb. pitties, american bulldogs, etc... feed their dogs raw & it works out to roughly $1/day


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

There's an additive from dr.peter Tobias that adds minerals, herbs, calcium , omega which helps skin etc.
Most dog foods are short on omega and calcium. If you add some then it completes the dog food.

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275082,-122.835443


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## beN (Apr 21, 2010)

Grete_J said:


> Markup on dog food is less than 30%, chances of finding stores that will give you wholesale pricing are slim.
> 
> Inova & Evo were involved in a recall last year. We were feeding our guys Orijen 6 fish because Gambit has allergies to certain meats, chicken especially. Now we've got them on raw & loving his non-flakey skin  A lot of our friends with 50 - 80 lb. pitties, american bulldogs, etc... feed their dogs raw & it works out to roughly $1/day


Can't go wrong on the fish diet


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

Evo has had issues lately. They were removed from the top 10 list. I don't remember the issues. But remember hearing something.
Westies..seen alot in my 35 years of grooming with severe problems. So need to be careful.id go with fish, duck, or something not so common. I've heard alot of test results from various westies. Alot was chicken, definitely grains,

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275185,-122.835526


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

Grete_J said:


> Markup on dog food is less than 30%, chances of finding stores that will give you wholesale pricing are slim.
> 
> Inova & Evo were involved in a recall last year. We were feeding our guys Orijen 6 fish because Gambit has allergies to certain meats, chicken especially. Now we've got them on raw & loving his non-flakey skin  A lot of our friends with 50 - 80 lb. pitties, american bulldogs, etc... feed their dogs raw & it works out to roughly $1/day


do you mind if you ask your friend for their recipe? and prep as i m definately interested going that route for my pitbulls. especially my dam that has allergies

Thanks



April said:


> Evo has had issues lately. They were removed from the top 10 list. I don't remember the issues. But remember hearing something.
> Westies..seen alot in my 35 years of grooming with severe problems. So need to be careful.id go with fish, duck, or something not so common. I've heard alot of test results from various westies. Alot was chicken, definitely grains,
> 
> ---
> I am here: Google Maps


the westies are fine actually.. they're my moms dogs and they were always fed different food and i never liked that so i talked to my mom about feeding one kind of food for all our dogs.
and for evo i guess that will be out of the question then !

atm i do give my dogs fish oil capsules but no omega atm. 
will look into that


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## mdwflyer (Jan 11, 2011)

our Great Danes lived very happily on Eagle Pack, which became Holistic Select. We used to get it from Bosley's, as my wife worked there a few years ago. Recently they stopped carrying the brand. Went over to Roger's and asked if he could get it, as changing dogfood brands midlife isn't high on my list of priorities... He has been able to get it for us no problems.


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

Yeah, x2 on the recipe request. I feed the occasional cooked meal of homemade dog food, but haven't messed with the raw too much. When I cook it, it's normally about 20% grain, 50% protein and 30% fruits/veggies, grated or minced for digestibility and the whole thing cooked. I also throw in a spoonful of "live culture" yogurt on top when I feed to help the digestion work. She also gets salmon oil every morning with her food.

I was thinking about switching the cats over to raw, but they have different dietary reqs to the dog (taurine + meat only), so would need a very different recipe. Also, we have one cat who recently had a round of pancreatitis and is now on EVO venison cat food and nothing else, so try finding venison for making your own raw food unless you know somebody who hunts!


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

Here's a few links to sites with good info on raw diets

Raw Fed Dogs

Jane Anderson's Raw Learning Site

A thread on Hugabull that talks about raw diets & how grain isn't necessary

HugABull Advocacy and Rescue Society :: View topic - Raw

There's the Whole Prey model, which is 80% meat, 10% bone, 10% organ.
The BARF model, which is 80% meat/bone/organ, 20% veggies.

I'll find out which shops most people get their meats from later today


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

Grete_J said:


> Here's a few links to sites with good info on raw diets
> 
> Raw Fed Dogs
> 
> ...


may i know which specific one your buddies are using to feed their pits?
as i have the same breed and if his are doing find with that recipe, then i think i dont want to try another and would like to feed the same.
i m kind of new to it, so i kinda need a break down on where he buys it.. how he preps it and etc etc.. if thats ok 
then later on when i get the hang of it i will start experiencing a bit more with it.

thanks !


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

Everyone I know feeds them the whole prey model, us included. It took awhile for me to wrap my head around the fact that dogs don't require veggies. Grains, it's obvious. You're not going to see a rabbit/deer/goat sucking on a stalk of grain. Veggies though, the amount a dog would actually receive via stomach contents is minimal. Raw eggs with shells once a week are always a good source of protein & calcium!


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

so, i could just walk into a butcher shop, get a pound of ground beef or a slice of any sort of meat.
take it home and toss it to my dogs?

no need to freeze first then thaw? or prepare in some sort of way?

am i making this more complicated for myself than it actually is? LOL


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

Theoretically, yes. You'd have to make sure that the ground beef/meat contains the appropriate percentages of muscle/organ/bone. I like feeding our guys chunks of meat, makes it more fun for them & gives their jaws more of a workout! Same with bones.

Oh & if anyone's looking for cheap antlers, I should have a cheap hookup


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

bones, i was a bit aware of it as i m afriad my dogs wont chew it up and just swallow..

i will check with my usual butcher shop in a bit to see what they can do for me !


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

Bones are good for keeping their teeth clean, but if you're wary of it, ask the butcher if they're able to have bone ground up 

Oh, & for those in the North Van area, In the Raw is where most people get their food.

http://www.intherawpetfood.com/


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## fishykisses (May 11, 2010)

if you think dry food is expensive, don't give a thought to raw. 
I have my 2 dogs (one 20lb, one 7lb) on raw food and it's a huge expense. I made my own for awhile but found it was just too much trouble when you have to make all the amounts balanced to make sure it was really nutritious. You should really add supplements as well to make sure and those are really pricey as well. My dogs also developed an allergy to chicken which my vet said is a really common allergy, so that's another thing to watch out for.
I have definitely found a big difference in my dogs since putting them on raw, their coats are super shiny, very few health problems, less skin allergies. 
My papillion was a puppy mill dog that was rescued out after about 5 years. He had so many health problems from his eyes (one was poked by chicken wire and then abcessed) to itchy allergy skin and a host of other issues. 
If you sign up to Nature's Variety, you can get coupon's from them periodically. They also package their food nicely. You can get either bags of little pucks or full size patties depending on the size of your dog. The other brands I like a lot are Jake and Daisy and Red Dog, Blue Cat.
On the other hand, if i had many dogs or bigger dogs, there's no way i could afford it, 2 weeks with my little dogs cost me $40-$60 in raw.


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

fishykisses said:


> if you think dry food is expensive, don't give a thought to raw.
> I have my 2 dogs (one 20lb, one 7lb) on raw food and it's a huge expense.


That's interesting that it cost you so much when combined, your 2 dogs would only need to be fed 1/2 lb daily.



fishykisses said:


> You should really add supplements as well to make sure and those are really pricey as well.


To save you the trouble of navigating, here's the page about myths of supplements.

Jane Anderson's - Myths of Supplments

Nothing an egg every now & then or frozen, raw fish can't help. I don't believe our canines less domesticated cousins have access to anything other than their natural resources to attain the proper balanced diet.

That's making me think of how our 7lb. one attacks & finishes a herring the length of her in the time it takes my 55lb. guy to get 1/2 through the same 



fishykisses said:


> If you sign up to Nature's Variety, you can get coupon's from them periodically. They also package their food nicely. You can get either bags of little pucks or full size patties depending on the size of your dog. The other brands I like a lot are Jake and Daisy and Red Dog, Blue Cat.


One more, here's a link to Nature's Variety recall of 2011:
List of recalls for Pet Food Products from Nature's Variety Raw Frozen Diet, Chicken Formula

I do applaud Nature's Variety for issuing the recall quickly though! Much better than Innova/Evo sitting on their butts or Timberwolf Organics issuing an apology afer over a year for misinforming the public as to quality of meat used.


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

fishykisses must be feeding grade AAA beef steak or something LOL

but wow thats alot of money for those mini dogs


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## elemental (Jul 29, 2010)

Good raw chicken meat bone and organ in about $2.60 lb
Beef meat bone and organ about $3.80

This is ground bone, so no worries.
I think natural balance isn't great.

Low protein and low fat to the point of being a "clinical" diet food, and regularly contaminated with soy and beef. Ill find the link for the study if I can.

Acana has a buy 11 get the 12th bag free.
You'd feed half as much if you went to a grain free like Acana Orijen or even Taste of the wild. (theres savings right there) But you should avoid chicken and gluten if one of your dogs has allergies till you know the cause.
Now is turkey duck and salmon.
Go has a chicken and veg, salmon and oatmeal and a duck variety.

If you have a gst/hst number than you can buy from a distributor. 
Most companies have a breeder program but only for ckc registered breeders.


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## Rastapus (Apr 21, 2010)

elemental said:


> Good raw chicken meat bone and organ in about $2.60 lb
> Beef meat bone and organ about $3.80
> 
> This is ground bone, so no worries.
> ...


It is unlikely that a distributor will sell to anyone just because they have a HST number, they will need an actual store front. I cant go buy anything I want at wholesale anywhere I like just because I have a number.......
Raw diet is very popular but IMO you wont save money. In Vanuatu where meat is cheap it still was not worth it for me to feed my dogs, they ate better then I did! Dry food, even the good stuff will always be cheaper.
Support your LPS, dog food is a volume game, how much would you honestly expect to save?


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## elemental (Jul 29, 2010)

Jamieson Pet Food Distributors(Acana and Orijen, Go and Now) sell to breeders with hst numbers
Anipet (natural Balance, Wellness,Horizon) sell to breeders with hst, so some do.

A local independent may be willing to do a discount if you order a certain amount. Ask around.


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

That's if they are an actual breeder kennel who declares their earnings etc to income tax. 
Hopefully their hst is for that company and not some other. 
There's a great raw food company that was my neighbour shop. K-9 raw food he delivers. Carl. Their food is very convenient and he supplies kennels. He knows his stuff. 
Check them out. More personal and better price. Tell him April sent you.
http://naturalk9diet.com/index.html

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275052,-122.835535


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## fraggalrock (Apr 21, 2010)

I have a wholesale account and several suppliers because I have a non profit animal based rescue group.Trust me I have the ability to see the mark-up on pet food which is almost nothing.Most pet store/suppliers will sometimes sell at cost or below it because they hope you will be buying the other items with high mark-ups like toys and gadgets.Buy the best food you can afford and if you find your dog food bill too high maybe you have more dogs than you can afford? Its not meant as an insult but with animals there are no shortcuts you will end up paying for it somewhere save more on food pay more at the vet.Just my 2 cents.


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## Rastapus (Apr 21, 2010)

A local food distributor refused to sell to me in Richmond because of my proximity to Tisol. The same Tisol that sells fish food. Believe me, they can be pickier with who they sell to more then you may think.


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

Yes they choose. Some sell to specific stores or smaller stores and not box stores etc.
They also have their districts.
I guess you are right next to tisol. I'm just around the corner from bosleys.so far no issues. But I'm only selling petcurean and Orijen.

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.275131,-122.835548


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## Rastapus (Apr 21, 2010)

April said:


> Yes they choose. Some sell to specific stores or smaller stores and not box stores etc.
> They also have their districts.
> I guess you are right next to tisol. I'm just around the corner from bosleys.so far no issues. But I'm only selling petcurean and Orijen.
> 
> ...


Tisol has sold fish products for years and years, I did not care as they have their customers and I have mine. I suppose they were concerned for reasons I still cant grasp considering Petcetera sold their lines and they are the same distance from me as Tisol. Need less to say it was a joke I wont soon forget or laugh over. The idea of territory etc. only hurts the product. Stores like Tisol sell every line practically where we focus on just a few key brands which would be obviously better promoted being our only chosen lines. This stupidity spills into the aquatics as well, ridiculous.


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## bonsai dave (Apr 21, 2010)

My wife and I get over dog food from Korna in North Van. They have a great selection of dry and raw food. Here is there website Natural-Plus Pet Food and Supplies, Ltd.. We have switch from raw back to dry cause it was costing us close to $ 200 a month to feed our 2 dog. We are now feeding the orijen. The dogs love it.


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## elemental (Jul 29, 2010)

April said:


> That's if they are an actual breeder kennel who declares their earnings etc to income tax.
> Hopefully their hst is for that company and not some other.
> There's a great raw food company that was my neighbour shop. K-9 raw food he delivers. Carl. Their food is very convenient and he supplies kennels. He knows his stuff.
> Check them out. More personal and better price. Tell him April sent you.
> ...


This is a recipe and format used by a tonne of raw people selling food made by others. Raw food SHOULD NOT contain beet pulp or oats....Ogh and thhey all claim to make it and have patented formats lol

Natural Dog Food from Chow for Now
Ingredients - Contact Us: (604) 825-2533 [email protected]
RawDiet.ca JDs Food4Thought

And several others....I think a top quality kibble would be prob be better for your needs and budget.


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

bumping this up...our dog appears to be having a round with pancreatitis and the vet has recommended trying a home cooked food. (She's currently on Orijen or Acana). They recommended this stuff (http://www.completeandbalanced.com/). I think it's a touch like the prescription diets, but does provide some ideas.

Any feedback? I'm fine to cook for her myself but am a bit nervous about raw and Djamm hates the idea. My main concern is ensuring that there are no major nutritional deficiencies. My preference is to feed a good mix of meats, organ, veggies/fruit with small amounts of brown rice and maybe the odd egg? Not sure if she needs a supplement beyond the salmon oil. I do feed raw bones every so often, and she will grind them to nothing, but I don't like giving them every day (messy!) so I would be fine to feed a calcium supplement if needed.

The last meal I fed her was about 1.5 cups of the following cooked mix with her usual salmon oil supplement:

1 cooked mashed acorn squash 
1 cup cooked brown rice
1.5lbs cooked ground chicken breast (boneless/skinless)
2 chopped lamb kidneys

All items cooked by simmering together on the stovetop until cooked through.


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

Can't say I'm a fan of the "prescription diets" as it's Hills & they've been involved in fairly significant recalls.

Instead of brown rice, why not sweet potato or yam? I did a bit of reading & the starchy foods can be overcooked to help with digestion. Whole eggs (shells included) are a good source of calcium... so are antler chews  I'm sure I can come up with other ideas, but the popcorn in my head is taking over


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## elemental (Jul 29, 2010)

Your recipe is low in vit D, A, E, and several minerals.
For every lb of meat you need minimum 800 mg elemental calcium. This is NOT optional. Youcan buy eggshell or coral calcium or save bake and grind your eggshells. Every 1/2 tsp is approx 800mg cal.

A dog energy requirements are:
weight in kg x30+70 that is whats needed calories wise to stay alive
Avg dog x1.6
so 10lb dog is 4.54x30=135+70=205
x1.6= 330 calories a day.

A typ diet should be a min 50% meat, 25% carbs and 25% veggies and supplements.
I usually advise 75% meat. Im not a fan of carbs...can be millet, sweet potatoes. Carbs are cellulose and very hard for a dog to digest. They can create inflammation in a dogs body as not natural for them to eat.

Liver is 10% of the meat....I dont like too much kidney as they are the bodies filter. Heart is a muscle meat and a better choice.

Your diet is low in protein and fat. Boneless skinless is great for us lazy fat omnivore humans...you need fat in a dogs diet.
Ground chicken thighs are better for dogs or you need to add 2 tblspoon olive oil or flax oil.

If you want a detailed recipe, list what meats you want to use, age weight sex breed and activity level of you dog and I can do one.


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## Grete_J (Oct 5, 2010)

I agree that a dog of healthy weight should have a higher fat & protein content in their diet, but Elle did state that her dog is going through a bout of pancreatitis. Dogs with pancreatitis should be on low fat, higher on carbs. 

Although I don't understand why people even feed carbs to dogs, they wouldn't naturally chose anything carb rich in nature. All vegetable matter can be gained via tripe & easily digested as opposed to straight up veggies.


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## April (Apr 21, 2010)

There's also a supplement you can get from dr. Peter Tobias. Adds the necessary calcium and minerals.

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I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=49.274933,-122.835466


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

Thanks guys. She's going in for an ultrasound as the blood test that came back made our vet want to rule out any kind of cancerous growth on the internal organs. 

She's a husky/rott X, 72lbs and fairly lean and active, 7 years old. Normally I would be feeding higher fat and protein, but while the pancreas is unhappy, chicken and lean meat is what she's getting. I'd prefer yam or sweet potato over rice, but I typically feed a chicken/rice blend for any kind of digestive upset, so I stuck with that first.

I'll use any meats, but right now we're keeping the fat low until we figure out what's going on. She's on Flagyl (antibiotic) and a painkiller at the moment and seems perfectly happy and active, so I'm hoping that it's NOT cancer.

We just went through this with one of the damn cats recently, so lightning apparently does strike twice. Thank god for pet insurance.


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## elemental (Jul 29, 2010)

therapeutic low fat is between 8-10%
Id say your diet is lower than that depending on how you cook the chicken. Try not to fry or over cook it. It changes the fat and makes it harder to digest.
I recommend poaching, not a raid boil, keeps the fat easier to digest.
I would recommend supplementing with coconut oil, as its a medium chain triglyceride and an easy to digest fat. Very little at first and building up.


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

Ultrasound came back clear, so at least anything dire has been ruled out for now.  Of course that leaves us at "what the hell WAS it, anyway?", but that's better than the alternative.

I usually simmer, not boil. Coconut oil is interesting, hadn't heard of that being used before.


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## katienaha (May 9, 2010)

my friend works for Habitat for Humanity, and OFTEN they get bags of dog food in from places like Costco, where the bag has a tear because it got tagged by a cart or a forklift, and its exceptionally cheaper. check your local HfH and see if they get the same.


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## elemental (Jul 29, 2010)

Also the pancreas regulates insulin, so be careful about sweet items. While Id normally agree to remove all grains, rice in this case is better.

If you want to continue to cook check out DogAware.com: Diet & Health Info for Man's Best Friend
Great recipes and supplement information especially dogs with illnesses.
Hope she feels better soon!


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## Allington (Feb 6, 2012)

Thanks everyone for sharing his comments. But I'm not concerned with the quantity. If you can prevent 
it to be staled. 
APRIL'S AQUARIUM is not working properly.


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