# Blackfish (documentary, 2013)



## Fire_eel

After watching this documentary today, I will never support an aquarium that houses Orcas ever again. This documentary isnt like The Cove in any way, none of the orcas die, but it shows what a barbaric society we live in and why orcas shouldnt be held captive.

I downloaded it earlier today and I recommend that you all see it.

If you have seen it, what did you think?


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## peppy2013

Posting a link for the trailer for the film

Blackfish Official Film Site


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## Diztrbd1

Personally I don't think any animals should be held in captivity as such. But I must say I find the use of "barbaric society" kind of ironic when it comes to Orca's. Ever seen this:





chased them down for 3 hours before finally killing the baby. All they ate was the jaw, pretty much killed it for the practice.They are remarkable creatures, but not very nice in the wild.

Couple more vids of their true nature: 










Now you can say thats just nature, but most other animals in nature kill for survival, not for practice.
Not a big fan of them after I seen those documentaries, but at the same time I agree they should not be captured the way they are and put in captivity.
As for the "barbaric society we live in, well apparently thats in our nature as well unfortunately.

Interesting interview with the Blackfish film maker:


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## Fire_eel

I did want my piranha to eat a mouse, but that really has nothing to do with what Im discussing here. 
Killer Whales are intelligent, top predators and we have been raised to think of them as cute and cuddly. They are anything but. The comparison of barbaric practices between housing Killer Whales and using a feeder mouse for your piranha arent even in the same league. These whales are thought to be sentient, and anything sentient should not be used in any display of 'zoo' type business for profit. Exceptions COULD be made for orphans or animals found injured that we can cure. In any case, I think this documentary is very important to watch, and if you have kids, make sure they understand the parts YOU think are important for them to know.

Hopefully there wont be any wild whales/dolphins captured in the future for purposes of captivity. I am even leaning towards letting injured/orphaned whales die so they dont have to live in captivity... unless the species is endangered or about to go extinct then sure save the injured for breeding purposes but NOT for any other reason.


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## DBam

Here's something I read today, from one of the most experienced orca trainers featured in the documentary. It may make you think twice about the motives behind Blackfish.

http://micechat.com/53915-blackfish-exposed/

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## Vancitycam

No not really. I saw the movie before this thread and when aquariums were mentioned in the bcspca thread as an educational place I just laughed at what a bunch of misinformation. That article doesn't discredit the truths in the movie about bad things we humans do it just questions the intentions for making it and I could really careless if another person profits or wins an award if that's a persons concern they missed the point of the film. It boils down to dollars over sense, what's done is done we know its wrong so release them? No, Any half witted person knows that wont work so just stop the breeding and removal/sales of the babies and end the orcas in captivity and trainers teaching them tricks but that can't happen it makes to much money. 

I mean is it really the trainers fault, no. They were just doing a job they loved with animals they loved unfortunately having them in that kind of environment sets the animal up for failure. Like really let's put a cub on a leash seperate it from its mother put it in a pen make it preform its whole life and starve to lure back to the cage at night and we will all be surprised when a trainer gets mauled.


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## Vancitycam

I love bbc's cgi haha I just watched the added videos and it is just nature they may have eaten the baby if they weren't chased off and as for animals killing for sport I know meerkat females slaughter any offspring that's not their own not quite sport but still not for survival

Thanks for the post I wish more people were educated on animal welfare topics and profits came second.


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## nigerian prince

business's are far better at protecting animals than 99% of "charities" so i wouldn't say profit is evil


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## Fire_eel

profit can be evil when the animals are mistreated to acquire said profit


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## Diztrbd1

It appears with this species, business is who they need protected from. Personally I have never seen a Killer Whale or Dolphin up close (in captivity) but would far more appreciate seeing them in their natural habitat if I ever do get to see them. It is shame we take any living creature away from it's natural environment solely for the purpose of exploitation or entertainment purposes.


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## nigerian prince

1 - i really don't know enough about it, i think aquariums do a lot of good with rehabilitation, taking in animals and whatnot, and most importantly expose kids to creatures of the sea..

2 - weather you like it or not a lot of people couldn't care less about sea life until they take a trip to these places

3 - i just don't trust environmental nuts, they almost always have ulterior motives

4 - watching a 2 hour documentary doesn't make you an expert about anything, most of the rabid black fish nuts i know , watch the movie, do absolutely no additional research whatsoever, preach to everyone about the movie, and if you challenge them a week later (if they haven't moved on to the next "hearts in the right place" cause yet, you'll find out they don't really care at all


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## Vancitycam

It's awesome to see them in the wild! I have relatives that still own a r.v. Camp / fishing lodge on van island (was way more popular in the 50's and 60's I'm told haha 80's baby here) none the less I have loved it over there fishing and seeing whales, seals and everything else in the wild even if its just a seal that pops out from under the boat to steal your salmon before you can net it haha. I have also been to vancouver aquarium and seaworld on a Disneyland vacation as a child so I have seen both sides. Very few people are profiting from orcas by tourism and whale watching just because its not a wow factor as seaworld can be


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## Vancitycam

nigerian prince said:


> 1 - i really don't know enough about it, i think aquariums do a lot of good with rehabilitation, taking in animals and whatnot, and most importantly expose kids to creatures of the sea..
> 
> 2 - weather you like it or not a lot of people couldn't care less about sea life until they take a trip to these places
> 
> 3 - i just don't trust environmental nuts, they almost always have ulterior motives
> 
> 4 - watching a 2 hour documentary doesn't make you an expert about anything, most of the rabid black fish nuts i know , watch the movie, do absolutely no additional research whatsoever, preach to everyone about the movie, and if you challenge them a week later (if they haven't moved on to the next "hearts in the right place" cause yet, you'll find out they don't really care at all


1- that's whats called a beard

2- if they don't care before I bet they don't care after they leave either

3- I don't trust nuts either (agreed)

4- a.d.d. Maybe? It's a fast paced world.


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## nigerian prince

i dont think its the wow factor i think its the price and convenience , r.v's are great though 
costs 10x more and takes 10x more time, those are two huge factors, i want to see them one day, all i've seen are dolphins in the wild


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## Vancitycam

We don't do whale watching it just happens by accident I know the r v side went way down but they have cabins too. I meant wow factor whale watching with the people who do offer those services or seeing a trainer launched off of it and hand feeding. Sorry for any confusion.


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## kim86

I was able to see the killer whale that used to be at the Vancover aquarium. It was awesome to see as a kid, but if I saw an orca like that now I would be really sad. They're huge, first of all. No tank is big enough to let them live the life they deserve. Blackfish is an alright movie but it shouldn't take a movie like that to convince people that orcas in captivity is wrong. Going out and whale watching on a boat would be 10000x more exciting I think. Anyway... let's all watch free willy and feel happy when willy jumps over the rocks to be with his homies


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## cadillac_jack

Cant get sea sick on land... all the land lubber wanna see the whale, but dont want to be barfing in davy jones locker .. lol


kim86 said:


> I was able to see the killer whale that used to be at the Vancover aquarium. It was awesome to see as a kid, but if I saw an orca like that now I would be really sad. They're huge, first of all. No tank is big enough to let them live the life they deserve. Blackfish is an alright movie but it shouldn't take a movie like that to convince people that orcas in captivity is wrong. Going out and whale watching on a boat would be 10000x more exciting I think. Anyway... let's all watch free willy and feel happy when willy jumps over the rocks to be with his homies


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## DBam

Vancitycam said:


> Thanks for the post I wish more people were educated on animal welfare topics and profits came second.


Thank you, this is not a simple issue with simple solutions. 
Vancity and others have mentioned the money involved. Please consider this:
The documentary is owned by CNN and was also funded by PETA. PETA is only as credible as you believe it to be, but I don't really want to discuss them here. Defense or criticism of PETA can be opened in another thread, or under the existing thread about PETA and betas. CNN is in the Time Warner umbrella, and Time Warner used to own the Australian SeaWorld. They also have plans to put more theme park attractions around the world, just look up the Australian-based Village Roadshow Theme Parks venture, their expansion plans are available on Wikipedia. Blackfish was released 2 months after SeaWorld stock went public, and was purchased and broadcasted by CNN. The distribution of the documentary is likely for the purpose of killing the SeaWorld stock value, so Time Warner and Village Roadshow can do a takeover and put up more SeaWorld theme parks, because with SeaWorld, they gain a major attraction that occupies a niche they might not otherwise fill. 


Vancitycam said:


> No not really. I saw the movie before this thread and when aquariums were mentioned in the bcspca thread as an educational place I just laughed at what a bunch of misinformation.


I politely disagree, I think aquariums and zoos are important ambassadors for education and inspiration. I probably won't see every animal I've seen in aquariums and zoos in their natural element, so I'm grateful for these facilities.


Vancitycam said:


> . That article doesn't discredit the truths in the movie about bad things we humans do it just questions the intentions for making it and I could really careless if another person profits or wins an award if that's a persons concern they missed the point of the film.


You're right that the article doesn't say that the movie is all lies. She says that their attempt to address the opposing point of view involved them using a tragedy to get her to speak, but did not allow her to share her experience or expertise. I would call that a failure on the part of the director. If the trainer, when asked if people should watch it says, "No, not unless they have someone like me to fill in what's missing," and that if she ran SeaWorld, "I would end animals for entertainment purposes, and stop the breeding program," I can't help but think that this person knows the ins and outs that Blackfish should've been able to capitalize on. If the people behind Blackfish weren't so radical, then people like Bridgette could help fill out a truly informative documentary and wouldn't feel compelled to distance themselves.

I've also seen many, many whales in the wild such as wild orcas, humpbacks, grays, dolphins and porpoises including the humpback that died and washed up in Whiterock last year (before it died) and Luna before the media storm. It's amazing and not everyone gets to do that. Maybe the future of commercial encounters with large cetaceans will be limited to eco-tourism. Here's hoping.

In no place in this have I suggested that keeping orcas in facilities is ok. I think that preying on reactions and emotions to sell something is wrong.


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## cadillac_jack

its unfortunate but fact is so long as there is money to be made all the videos in the world arent gonna stop it from going down. elephants tigers ect ect it will never end. right or wrong.


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## Vancitycam

Dbam you are certainly entitled to you own opinion, whatever it may be. So I won't repost on any points because clearly we could agree to disagree. 

Caddilac jack you are so very right sady, the only way it would even end is probably after its too late and the damage is done both by ignorance and "education". If things were only observed and left be...


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## scott tang

there should be a strict line between an animal embasitor and a zoo on one hand people need to be educated about difrent animals on the other hand you have to look anf think at what cost to the animals does it need to happen


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## Momobobo

DBam said:


> I politely disagree, I think aquariums and zoos are important ambassadors for education and inspiration. I probably won't see every animal I've seen in aquariums and zoos in their natural element, so I'm grateful for these facilities.


+1 

Zoos and Aquarium do put a huge amount of effort into breeding and rehabilitating animals which is ZERO profit for 99% of animals (exceptions being "cute" animals). They provide a place for youth to go and be up close and personal with animals. Not something you can do otherwise in metropolitan areas. After all, seeing is believing. Well run Zoos and Aquariums have my support 100%.


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## Momobobo

(Double post because I can't edit without my comment not showing up?)

I cannot understand why you guys rag on Zoos and Aquariums while poachers, commercial fishers, factories, and governments (shark culling anybody) kill, maim, and hurt these animals FAR more.


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## Fire_eel

Momobobo said:


> I cannot understand why you guys rag on Zoos and Aquariums while poachers, commercial fishers, factories, and governments (shark culling anybody) kill, maim, and hurt these animals FAR more.


We have to hear about it first. 
Many docs have already been made about shark-finning, and i *hope* NOBODY on this site eats shark fin soup. If you do Im going to beat you up. Just kidding. dont ban me.

what can we do about poaching?


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## DBam

Fire_eel said:


> what can we do about poaching?


Did you read/hear news last year about sockeye poaching on the Fraser? Well that's been going on for years, and the sport fishermen who know and the CO's don't get involved because of the backlash they've faced from the poachers in the past. This is detracting from the main issue of marine Cetacea in captivity, but this is an important local issue involving poaching that people should probably know about.

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## nigerian prince

are the poachers indians?


DBam said:


> Did you read/hear news last year about sockeye poaching on the Fraser? Well that's been going on for years, and the sport fishermen who know and the CO's don't get involved because of the backlash they've faced from the poachers in the past. This is detracting from the main issue of marine Cetacea in captivity, but this is an important local issue involving poaching that people should probably know about.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Diztrbd1

lol Does it really matter? Poaching is poaching and against the law no matter who you are!


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## nigerian prince

i couldnt agree more


Diztrbd1 said:


> lol Does it really matter? Poaching is poaching and against the law no matter who you are!


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## kacairns

Only the white **vil can poach in BC waters, everyone else its their "right" and who really wants more blockades, protests if fisheries cracks down on people who are just practicing their "rights". Plus they are just using those huge nets to catch just enough to feed their immediate family, plus extended family, plus everyone else they know, plus everyone that everyone else knows and they swear they aren't selling any of it so people should just be turning a blind eye because its their "right" and its the political correct thing to do...

In all honesty I remember as a child seeing the killer whales at the aquarium, I remember learning about them in school. First time my children had seen/heard of a killer whale was on the ferry one time and now watching this biased attempt at making money they call a documentary. Although the Vancouver Aquarium was very undersized as a suitable display for them, I thought other then that they did a pretty good job at educating people, showing how majestic a animal they are and did it all without being in the water with them as far as I recall. Places like Seaworld, whom have a much larger habitat for them just wanted to commercialize on it by turning it into a circus show to some extent and because of that people have lost their lives unfortunately.

Get the boat ready we are going grey whale hunting....


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## cadillac_jack

lol your walking a fine line with that one , lol thats a different matter all together. "heritage" there is no good way to talk about that one .


nigerian prince said:


> are the poachers indians?


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## cadillac_jack

but i dont remember any of their ancestors using gill nets and speed boats, but if your trying to wipe out a species then fishing at the mouth of its migratory path seems like a good idea


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## DBam

Please guys, it was just meant to be an example of real-life, in your backyard poaching, and nothing more.

It's funny to watch some people get all activisty on BCA. Tell them something they didn't know or don't want to hear and the conversation ends. If SeaWorld keeps orcas in gigantic pools and that is still inadequate, maybe all fish keepers should be stopped from housing little fish in little tanks, hmmm? Is that a discussion anyone here wants to have? I'm sure some radical people would follow that logic. We are all here because we love keeping aquariums. Emily said it best on the SPCA thread; let's consider the consequences before we jump on a kumbaya bandwagon and bite off the hand that gives us our great hobby.

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## fisherman

is this the one??

Watch Blackfish online - download Blackfish - on 1Channel | LetMeWatchThis


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## Diztrbd1

that would be the one. i got a copy from here: https://kickass.to/blackfish-2013-hdrip-x264-playnow-t7851553.html


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## Fire_eel

I downloaded mine from Frostwire.com

Been using them for 10 years now, back when they were called Limewire


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## Vancitycam

DBam said:


> It's funny to watch some people get all activisty on BCA. Tell them something they didn't know or don't want to hear and the conversation ends.
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


Conversation ends or people just give up trying to make others see reason. It's not an arguement or something to win its just being the bigger person there but nice low blow, you proved my point. Aces my friend.


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## fisherman

why do you guys download?? you can stream it without downloading at vodly.to.. just make sure you use adblocked, and dont download any of their stuff its probably a virus, you dont need to download anything to play the videos..

the putlocker links are pretty solid..

for anyone who wants to watch the doc without dling click here, click continue as free user
http://www.putlocker.ws/file/33F2CBD89D1E4BB4


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## DBam

Vancitycam said:


> Conversation ends or people just give up trying to make others see reason. It's not an arguement or something to win its just being the bigger person there but nice low blow, you proved my point. Aces my friend.


It's been fun Vancity, but I won't escalate this; I don't fight on the internet, I use it to share information. Have fun doing whatever it is that you do, I have hobby-related matters on my mind. Please direct any further comment to me in the form of a PM.


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## Diztrbd1

fisherman said:


> why do you guys download?? you can stream it without downloading at vodly.to.. just make sure you use adblocked, and dont download any of their stuff its probably a virus, you dont need to download anything to play the videos..
> 
> the putlocker links are pretty solid..
> 
> for anyone who wants to watch the doc without dling click here, click continue as free user
> Blackfish 2013 WEBRip XViD juggs avi | PutLocker


It's personal preference....I DL them so I have the option to burn them if I want. Plus you don't have to deal with buffering interruptions while watching. IME the odds of getting a virus are better when dling plug-ins from sites as such with the generic/unknown video players & ect. As it stands now i don't need an adblocker with UTorrent ....plus I can choose exactly which file I want to dl. All I have to do is run a 5 sec scan of the file with AVG to verify it's good and good to go from that point. I haven't had a virus in years. Though it helps to know what files are safe and which ones aren't, which I have learned over the years. I have gotten the majority of dl's from that site. It has a great community that weeds out the crap pretty quick and most dl's are pretty quick. Rest assured if I post a link, it is 99.9% safe.


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## cadillac_jack

Did me and kacairns just agree on something... lol,


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## cadillac_jack

Now Now boys, no fighting .. its like this it is the same exact argument about politics, religion, zoo's, aquariums and so on and so forth their is no good way to talk about your views without someone talking back and within 5 mins both sides are taking shots or passive aggressive one liners at each other. people are gonna have their own personal views and trying to change someones mind would be like trying to teach a kkk member not to be racist its rather fruitless and your both gonna run out of gas before the trip is over.

So documentary / aquariums / killer whales / natives in the river all all un-winnable conversations.. lets all agree that profit off of animals in the name of entertainment OR education is bad and While they are cool to look at would really be better off in the wild.

.the same very statement could be made to ALL of us for housing our fishies but Im not planning on retiring just yet.So lets all be friends and agree that whales are cool, aquariums are cool and that peta while on paper sounds good is really really nuts and hypocritical.

Good Monday Morning


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## Vancitycam

Agreed to disagree long ago my friends, just can't not say anything after being called out. Dbam don't call me out with a one liner and I won't have to respond, a public post requires a public reply, but pm me if you feel the need or not.


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## cadillac_jack

well that almost worked.


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## nigerian prince

why do people keep saying that animals are better off in the wild, opposed to captivity? nobodies arguing against it. like 5-6 people have said that hahaha


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