# HELP..with my substrate decision



## jobber (May 14, 2010)

As I value a lot of the members input and knowledge on this forum, I am seeking your consultation in selecting the right substrate for my soon to be new tank.

My criterions:
-want black
-good for corydoras whiskers
-can still grow plants
-enable a amazon biotope look natural to the corydoras

Have my eyes set on Seachem Onyx sand at the moment. But haven't seen much members using it. I've done a lot of reading and researching lately. I've been given choices of eco-complete and fluval stratum (if it comes in black)

Do you have a better suggestion? What are the pros and cons of onyx sand? Have you used onyx sand and kept corydoras?

Thank you in advance.


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## O.C.D Fishies (Apr 21, 2010)

I have been told that eco-complete is not good for cory's barbels. George has had a few in his tank for a few months though and they seem ok.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

My Sterbai did fine with my Eco-complete, but it's a bit too coarse for most cories and finer graine material like Onyx would be better. It also depends on whether you will be putting a lot of rooted plants in the tank. If you plan on putting in lower light plants like crypts, java fern and Anubias, you can use plain inert sand.


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## Tarobot (Jun 27, 2010)

ive read ecos nutrient depletes fast n causes algae if the tank isnt well planted so it seems like a loselose situation. i think fluval stuff seem a little pricy sincr u want 3-4 inches of it. im plannin the same project with cory n black sand ithinl im going to go with the onyx but the only other option is florabase


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Tarobot said:


> ive read ecos nutrient depletes fast n causes algae if the tank isnt well planted so it seems like a loselose situation.


This is false. Unless it's a terrestrial based substrate (like using potting soil) you cannot get algae from the substrate. The nutrient depletion point is valid, but only compared to ADA AS. Whether you use Flourite, Onyx, Eco-complete or Florabase, none of those last very long compared to ADA AS. But if you're dosing EI, it's almost irrelevant.


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Yeah, I'm not too concerned about the nutrients in the substrate since I've finished reading "bca chapter 3 - fertilizing, ei dosing, micro and macros". Hehe.

I know that corydora whiskers are also effected by water quality. I'm done with florabase and moving onto new stuff I have not tried. I know for certain that flourite had damaged my previous batches of corydora whiskers in my old 5 gallon tank.

Plant wise, I'd like to have more amazon swords...after seeing gary's new cube tank, it has inspired me to focus more on having a amazon biotope with ones side of the tank planted and the other side driftwood waste land...so if anyone has extra driftwood sitting around..I'll be interested.

I tried searching and researching info on onyx sand, but really extrapolate much information to help me make a more assure decision. So I gotta come here for some grassroot consultation. I'm open to all ideas...


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## CRS Fan (Apr 21, 2010)

Flourite Black (regular) is also fine for cories if you don't want a sand like substrate.

Best Regards,

Stuart


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## taureandragon76 (Apr 21, 2010)

For Black I really like tahitian moon sand. If your growing mainly easy plants you don't really need a nutrient enriched substrate. My 135g has a few swords,aponagetan's and crypt's and I use a sand from target that is pretty fine and all the plants grow well and flower from time to time. All I do is use jobe plant spikes under the plants.


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

shouldn't have a problem with Cories and planted tank. A healthy plant will look after the substrate for the corydoras. I have had healthy Cories' whiskers in plain gravel, flourite, ada soil. Here is a photo of them in ada soil.

I have had cories whisker erode as well. I found they either need a very very thin layer of substrate <1/4" or very thick layer 1.5"+ to keep the whiskers healthy looking. Anything around 1/2" to 1" is asking for erosion.

Onyx sand has bicarbonate in there. 
flourite does not. At least dark and classic flourite does not.

I am using flourite/onyx mixed in my smaller tanks now and have great results with growing plants. I used to have the mixed in the 75g until I swapped out for ada soil. flourite/onyx is easier to use than ada soil from my personal experience.

Ada soil will make the water acidic and contains ammonia. A little too acidic for echinodorus to do exceptionally well.

Photo is roughly 4 years old.









Photo taken in 2006. flourite mixed









photo taken in 2004. plain gravel with 1 bag of flourite









I lost all my discus when we did a renovation to the house. They died from stress of the month long renovation


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Loving the feedback. I'm thinking and leaning towards going with a onyx black mix with black sand. Just want the best for the future cories, yet still want to be able to grow nice plants. I think by having sand, it'll give the cories a home which emulates its natural habitat. 

Love this dilemma. I guess this is how multi-tank syndrome develops!


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Btw. Gorgeous sterbai you got there EDGE.


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## Luke78 (Apr 24, 2010)

CaribSea has a few nice 'nautral' looking substrates available.Worth checking them out , April has brought some in from time to time.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> Loving the feedback. I'm thinking and leaning towards going with a onyx black mix with black sand. Just want the best for the future cories, yet still want to be able to grow nice plants. I think by having sand, it'll give the cories a home which emulates its natural habitat.
> 
> Love this dilemma. I guess this is how multi-tank syndrome develops!


Yep, that's how it works. You want too many different things to contain in one tank.

Don't know if it's the substrate or the size of the tank, but my Sterbai were forever hiding in the 15 gallon planted with dark Eco-complete, but in the cube with white quartz sand, they are swimming all over the tank, like totally different fish. They can do well in all kinds of substrate, but it seems they really prefer sand.


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## rlove250 (Apr 29, 2010)

I have a layer of onyx sand in the bottom of my tank. The top is a layer of plain black aquarium gravel. I also added a box of laterite to the onyx sand to give it a more robust composition. It's been in there for 1.5 years and im pretty happy with it since I've only been in this hobby for 2.5 years.

My only concern is that because it is sand like, I am not sure if compaction becomes a problem and creates anerobic areas that can cause problems.


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

2wheelsx2 said:


> Yep, that's how it works. You want too many different things to contain in one tank.
> 
> Don't know if it's the substrate or the size of the tank, but my Sterbai were forever hiding in the 15 gallon planted with dark Eco-complete, but in the cube with white quartz sand, they are swimming all over the tank, like totally different fish. They can do well in all kinds of substrate, but it seems they really prefer sand.


That's exactly what I want the cories to do....to exhibit their full personality in a bigger tank with more space to roam. your idea for a 40 gallon breeder was what i had my eyes set on also, but this 33gallon long from jkam was hard to pass up on. i've passed up on a few other tanks over the past few months 

but this one, i just could not resist.

gary you're tank is just amazing. it reminds me those tanks at the Vancouver Aquarium - Amazon section


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

rlove250 said:


> I have a layer of onyx sand in the bottom of my tank. The top is a layer of plain black aquarium gravel. I also added a box of laterite to the onyx sand to give it a more robust composition. It's been in there for 1.5 years and im pretty happy with it since I've only been in this hobby for 2.5 years.
> 
> My only concern is that because it is sand like, I am not sure if compaction becomes a problem and creates anerobic areas that can cause problems.


thanks for sharing your experience with onyx sand. i think with any substrate, you can get anaerobic issues. i'm not too worried about that since i'll have plants and corydoras digging around in the sand.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> thanks for sharing your experience with onyx sand. i think with any substrate, you can get anaerobic issues. i'm not too worried about that since i'll have plants and corydoras digging around in the sand.


Yep, that happened with my 125 even, when I was on a business trip. My wife doesn't do anything but feed the fish and she overfed them that time and when I came back, there was slimy bacteria everywhere and when I did a gravel vac, gas bubbles came up, so it can definitely build up in any substrate (although I've never had it in the specialized plant substrates like Eco-complete or Florabase).


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## splat (Nov 17, 2010)

i used flourite black and it was not good for my corys whiskers. if i could redo it, i would definitely pick the sand for them


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Thanks splat for the confirmation. I'd decided to sacrifice some plants for the better treatment of fish.

Black sand it is!


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