# Fixing my ammonia spike/ph drop...



## Tu'Big (Sep 9, 2010)

Hi peeps! So I recently lost my Silver Tiger, Steve and I now have a fairly good grasp on what happened. My PH dropped, how, I'm not entirely certain. But it is what it is.

As a result of PH dropping to 5.5, my bacteria died off and that led to a spike in ammonia and the death of the Tiger and near deaths of 2 phoenix.

As of right now, there is no ammonia, nitrite or nitrate thanks to the NitraZorb packet in one of the 2 Fluval stage 3+'s. Boy do those things work TERRIBLY well! I have also been adding sparse amounts of AmQuel and the usual prime during w/c's.

I also picked up some nutrafin ph up product, hoping it would help a bit. After adding at least 90 drops to my 150g tank, I haven't seen any PH gain greater than a w/c I did 3 days ago that got my PH up to 5.8.

Yesterday I picked up 50 more bio stars, to replace some super super old ceramic rings, leaving 2 more trays of these old rings in the FX5's. Now there's 1 FX5 with over 150 biostars, and another FX with 50 stars and 2 trays of ceramic rings mixed with crushed coral.

Uh, so that's after I rinsed out one of the FX5's, eh? That leaves one more FX5 to clean out, probably tonight or tomorrow... or whenever I can get my PH back up to bacteria hospitality terms...

As is, I've been recharging the NitraZorb every 2 days and cleaning both 3+'s every day or two to get all the junk out I can.

I have a brand new bottle of Stability waiting to be dumped directly into my filters, if and when I can get PH up. Thus I plan to get the other filter rinsed asap, because poo in the filter might be keeping my ph from rising.

However, I added about 1/2 a pound of crushed coral, in a net surrounding an FX5 outlet 2 nights ago and haven't seen any change. I took some of that coral out and put it in one of the FX5's this morning. Maybe it'll help, maybe not...

Also, it appears the my water parameters from my tap have changed since last I checked the PH. I'm in Central Burnaby and it used to be around 6.8-7ph and now I'm reading 6.0 from my taps. This is a LOT lower than I expected my tap water to be, and certainly isn't helping my situation at all.

Um, so I think that's it. To lay it out simply:
150g tank
PH 5.8
Ammonia,Nitrite/trate 0
~1lb of crushed coral in filters
~200 bio stars and 3-4 year old ceramic rings
2 FX5's and 2 3+'s, one with Nitrazorb and the other with crushed coral/sponge
Tap water ph 6.0

Finally, do you think I should mix up the dirt on the bottom of the tank? It's got some FloraBase on the bottom, maybe 1/4 of an inch thick in some places and lots of open bare bottom space. I don't think it's got a lot of debris/poo in it, but it might. There's a LOT of water movement in the tank and most of that stuff seems to get sucked into the 3+ filters. As well, the goldfish and Phoenix sift through the dirt to find food.

alright, well let me know any info you need for recommendations.


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## CRS Fan (Apr 21, 2010)

Hello Damien.

I'm glad you have begun to rectify your problem. I am so happy to hear you did not lose your other 2 Fei Feng.

Best regards,

Stuart


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## Tu'Big (Sep 9, 2010)

Informs CRS that he just came home from a friend's place and Zeitgeist, the 14" Fei Feng has now passed away.


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## Tu'Big (Sep 9, 2010)

Has just gotten his PH up to 6.6 with a little baking soda. The calculator said put 13 teaspoons and I added about 1/2 that and within 5 minutes my ph rose about .6-.7.

Sure it went up too quickly, hell I'm glad I didn't add the whole recommended dose, but now I can work on how I'm gonna keep it this way.

what I really need to figure out is why my tap water ph is 6.0, that's shamefully low for city water in Vancouver...


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## bonsai dave (Apr 21, 2010)

HI there. It's not a good idea to raise your ph that fast . The stress from such a quick jump will kill your fish. Plus when using backing soda it does not last long and will cause a another ph crash. When you have high ammonia and low ph . The ammonia is not a problem but when you raise the ph to above 6.5 to 7 that when the ammonia is toxic. The fish you are keeping can handle a low ph. When your ph gets that low the best thing you can do is to do is to change water every day about 40 to 50 % and do a good gravel clean. IF you clean your filters I would do it old tank water. I would not use 2 different water conditioners cause you can get a false ammonia reading . I would just use prime and try not to use so many diffrent products. The less chemicals you use the better of you are to solving your water problems.
Here is a link I found very helpful .Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle and cycling. Methods for ammonia, nitrite removal.


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## Tu'Big (Sep 9, 2010)

Thanks for the tips Dave, I already knew most, of it by heart.

The reason for the Amquel is that I was told it was a better way of removing Ammonia by another board member in private. I'm not naming names because I'd rather I was flamed at my expense than theirs. Also, I've been reading 0 ammonia for about 60 hours now, even without adding anymore conditioners period.

When I arrived home late last night I went to the chatroom and spoke with an individual about Zeit dying and after some discussion, was told maybe it'd be a good idea to put some baking soda in, in order to at least get the ph up temporarily.

I dissolved the, oh 6-7 teaspoons in a cup and poured some in just about all places of the tank. I waited 5-10 min and chatted some more before my first test. That's when I noticed the 6.6ish ph. I immediately freaked out, not because of bad advice or that I shoulda listened to my instinct and added less, but for concern over stressing the fish.

I knew about the ammonia being more potent and deadly at higher ph's, but since I've had 0 for a few days now, I didn't worry too much about that.

The thing about water changes is that I HAVE done 30% every day for 4 days now. With PH6 coming from my tap, it's not really raising my ph at all. Hence finding something else to do it for me. Most of the rest of the fish seem to be able to handle the lower PH, but the last phoenix doesn't seem to appreciate it.

There is no gravel, just florabase laid out in a very thin layer. and I mean it's not even to the top of my fingernail, where it even exists at all. There's still a ton of barebottom space in my tank with LOTS of current pushing poo, etc into the filter intakes, esp the Fluval Stage 3's, which I clean often to remove said poo.

Normally I don't add any other chems but Prime during W/C's. I don't use medications and use Salt/Heat combo to deal with sick fish.

Anyway, Tu'Big is the only reason I'm still in this hobby now. If I lose him, I think that's the end of me fish keeping, pretty much for good. As is, I think it's time to take the 150g down and replace it with the 77g 5'L x 16" T x 18" wide and plant it. I'm done with bare bottom arowana designed tanks w/o having an Aro any longer.

Well as is, I just woke up a little while ago, instantly checked on the fish, who sleep 3 feet from my head and did a test. The PH has dropped back to 6, but I'm happy that at least it's not the 5.8 it was, though unhappy that the ph has swung so much in such a short time span. But it's slightly better, some more water changes, the rinsing of that filter and Stability placed in both filters, as the PH is no longer critically low for the Bacteria.

Anyway, flame away internet, that's why I'm here...


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## CRS Fan (Apr 21, 2010)

Hello Damien.

I'm sorry to hear that you lost Zeit. Hopefully you do not lose your last Fei Feng. Amquel was highly recommended by a good friend of mine and the Prime never seemed to bring down the ammonia (I used Amquel when I was having rogue bacteria outbreaks with ammonia spikes several times). My fish would only stop gasping after adding in the Amquel (even if it was only a temporary fix).

Respectfully,

Stuart


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## MadgicBug (Apr 22, 2010)

Seems like you have moving in the right direction. Dirty filters will drive PH down. Amquel plus is similar to prime. I think Amquel (non-plus) is doesn't do nitrites\nitrates or something like that. The baking soda bit was probably what killed your fish. I know that 1 tsp all at once, in around 100gal can temporarily spike the ph from 6's to 8 instantly and then it corrects itself down, which like Dave said does more harm than good.

If you go with Baking soda, best to drip it in slowly and that is only used if you are fine tuning your parameters. I can't remember from my marine days, by there are 2 parts to PH\KH (something with hydroxyl and CaCO3 (alkalinity)) and Baking soda is only the hydroxyl part. Best to go pickup a GH\KH test kit to check your parameters and use something like Equilibrium to get the parameters up and use your PH up to fine tune it. Your CC will help (depending on flow, size and amount) to add CaCO3 to the water. I believe equilibrium will boost GH more that KH.


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## Tu'Big (Sep 9, 2010)

Baking soda was added AFTER I lost the fish. I'll take a look for my GH tester, it's gotta be here somewhere.


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## CRS Fan (Apr 21, 2010)

Baking soda (Sodium Bicarbonate) increases KH (as it is derived from carbonates). Your GH is most influenced by dissolved magnesium and calcium. I think overall, GH is the more important of total hardness.

Respectfully,

Stuart


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