# Help!



## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

My betta has been in my new tank about 4 days now and has been fine - suddenly this morning I turn the light on and his fins are all stuck down to his body not all flared out like usual. What's wrong with him ????


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## charles (Apr 21, 2010)

maybe it is just stress.


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

Do you think the Filter is stressing him out? I just turned it off ...


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

could be, but my after a few days of flaring at their reflection it seems like they lose interest. Their fins will not be flared all the time. Mine only do it when excited(feeding) or when they see one of my other Betta's. If he is swimming around and still eating I would not be too concerned with it. Maybe he was just sleeping and you woke him up


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## Death's Sting (Apr 21, 2010)

Test your tank water and report back to us. Also, Provide info on the tank and filter. Keep the filter running, you don't want the water to to become stagnant which causes oxygen depletion in the water column.


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

All tank parameters were normal except GH and KH which were low. 

The tank is a marineland pillar tank 6 gallons came with its own filter which I put on lowest setting. I tried to give him another pellet but he didn't want it this time.

His fins do NOT look good.


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

This is him the other day: 








And this is him today:


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## sunshine_1965 (Aug 16, 2011)

Are there any signs of fungus growing on him anywhere? Might look like cotton. Does it just stay there or does it swim about?


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

No fungus.

Well, he has spent some time sitting at the bottom as well as some time swimming around. He was just sitting around this morning though, not moving around but started moving more after I gave him a cpl pellets. He only ate one tho.


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

one is better than none lol keep in mind their stomachs are about the same size as their eyeball so maybe still full from the last feeding. Hopefully it's nothing serious.


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## Hollyhawk (Mar 28, 2011)

Some times I find my guy sideways and almost upsidedown in the anubias plant roots. Other times he is active and playing in the bubbles and filter stream. Keep an eye on him for now to see if this is just a pattern of play and rest...
I does seem like (even with an in tank heater), on really cold days he is less active.

Hope he is OK. Fingers crossed.


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

Argh ... I hope I didn't over feed him or something. If that is the case, should I just not feed him for a couple days, and do a gallon water change? For the future, *if I run out of betta pellets and have to use reg. fish flake, how much flake would I give him per day?* I fed him with flakes for his first 3 days here because I did not have betta food and am worried that is the issue.

Now he is just sitting at the bottom of the tank. *If I only change a gallon how much prime do I put in after? I don't want to overdose.*

As for pattern of rest and play, I could understand that, however, his fins look like crap and that is what is worrying me the most.


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## Luke78 (Apr 24, 2010)

Just based from my own experience(s), you might wanna consider skipping a feeding here and there even more depending on your maintenance schedule and housing situation, health of the betta, etc.As for pellets, i use Hikari micro pellets which i find easier for them to chew and a few will suffice.For flakes, there's quite a few brands out there and if i do feed i usually crumple one up very fine and that's it.Clean water and consistent steady temps are something to consider highly and very important.Try and get a hold of Almond leaves, good remedy for our fishy friends, lots of benefits.Hope your guy pulls through


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

I'm an idiot. I definitley overfed with the flake then. What do I do? Water change? No feedings for a couple days?


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

Agree with Luke about skipping a feeding but overfeedng is only the problem if it over eats, which in my exp, they do not do that in an aquarium or in the wild, no more than we would. One thing I try to always do is presoak their food. Dry food will expand a bit when you add water and I believe presoaking the food will help it expand before they eat it and it expands in their bellies instead. Believe me ...I offer more food than they can eat on a regular basis they only eat till they are full.


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## Luke78 (Apr 24, 2010)

I was in the same boat as you regarding prime and its use, and was instructed not to use a lot as its very strong and potent for our fish.What i have done now is use just a few drops for anything under 5 gallons.I would advise against a cap full cause that is good for anything up to 200L /50 Gallons! Seachem also has a betta conditioner available, so does Hagen which i believe adds a almond leave extract as well.Both decent, and i have used the two of them with positive results.

We've all made the mistake of overfeeding, key is not to continue to do so.Watch your guy when he eats, and how much they do eat or don't eat.Anything left over will spoil your water perimeters.Eye ratio as mentioned already by another member is a good one, they have small stomachs.Ive heard owners using split peas(slightly cooked or blanched ) to cure tummy ailments.



missnikki said:


> Argh ... I hope I didn't over feed him or something. If that is the case, should I just not feed him for a couple days, and do a gallon water change? For the future, *if I run out of betta pellets and have to use reg. fish flake, how much flake would I give him per day?* I fed him with flakes for his first 3 days here because I did not have betta food and am worried that is the issue.
> 
> Now he is just sitting at the bottom of the tank. *If I only change a gallon how much prime do I put in after? I don't want to overdose.*
> 
> As for pattern of rest and play, I could understand that, however, his fins look like crap and that is what is worrying me the most.


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

Thank you Luke and John for your advice... 

I don't want to give him a pea right now if he already over ate tho ... maybe tomorrow or the next day.

I'm just going to use one drop of Prime. I'm pretty sure the overfeeding spiked the ammonia (altho I dont have ammonia test kit - just assuming) and made him feel like poop. I hope he will be okay. Send positive vibes please


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## fishobsessed (Jan 1, 2013)

I had the same thing happen a few days after getting mine.He would also wedge in a plant face down and stay there for hours. I actually went to scoop him once and he swam away. I used Betta Fix and after a week or so he seems almost back to normal. I hope yours is okay.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

I agree with others about not feeding him and see.

Dont worry about the oxygen as he can breath above water. You can turn off the filter entirely if you can keep the tank clean enough.

If you want you can change some of his water, may be 30%, for now. Your betta might be perfectly fine, or may be just under stress, or may be your ammonia/nitrite is hurting him, or may be your Ph has crushed...

I was worried about you having an ammonia spike when you asked about cycling because your tank is not all that big the waste produced by rotten food and poocould become more concentrated quickly.

For me personally I would try to control the water quality with water change rather than a bacteria colony. Some people can do it but they are experienced fish keepers who do not overfeed and know when and how to vaccum and such.

About prime, you can try to get those smallest prime bottles (they are like $2 or so) and save the bottle when you are done. You are supposed to use 2 drops per gallon but you can use half dose or a bit more. If you get the big bottle it is hard to measure out just the right amount.

You can also buy Safe, which is the powder form of Prime, and you then just make a solution yourself and put it in this small prime bottle. It is cheaper that way.

You can also buy the dechlorinator crystal from Rick of Canadian Aqua Farm (he is a sponosr here and he offers free shipping, $10 for 100 g). You just need to add 1 crystal into your water (1 is meant for 5 gallon). It is cheaper than prime, and contains less unnecessary chemicals and is very easy to use. Although you have a 6 gallon, you can add 1 crystal.

When you change your water, please make sure you have the water at the same temp and add your decholrinator into your tank before adding your water. 

Or, you can try to fill up a bucket with water of the amount you want to change (e.g. 2 gallon), test the temp and adjust it until it is right, then put prim/decholorator into the tank and pour the water in your bucket into your tank slowly. You can use your hand to slow down the flow of the water (pour the water into your palm) or you can put a big continer (like a ice cream bucket or something) in the tank and pour the water in the cup so the water will slowly flow out of the cup into your tank.Doing it this way will not disturb your decoration/plant/gravel and creat too much current which might stress out your Betta who might be under some stress already.

You can add may be 1/2 tea spoon of squarium salt in the tank if you are concerned he might be sick or has fin rot or things like that. It should nto do him any harm even if he does not have fin rot.

It is okay to stop feeding him for a day or 2. It is probably better not to feed him too much.

Flakes for tropical fish should be fine for him, too, but it is easy to give too much and dirty your water.

You can buy a pack of Hikari betta food for around $3-4 if you like. Feed him one flaoting pellet at a time if you have the time. Watch him eat it, then put another one in when he is done with the first one; if he is not eating, take the food out. After a while, he will learn to coem to your hand for food, and you can figure out how many pellets he usually eats per feeding so you will not give him too much.

Mine eats only about 2-3 pellets at one time, and he has learned to come up for his food after just a few days since I started doing it this way.

Good luck.


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## CRS Fan (Apr 21, 2010)

Sometimes listless behaviour can be brought on by a temperature drop. Is your tank heated? The temperature has dropped quite a few degrees over the last couple days.

Best regards,

Stuart


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

Personally I have a 5g water jug (like the ones on the water dispensers) I make up 5g at a time that way I usually always have water ready.
Makes the measurements for additives a little easier imo too. Plus the water I don't use right away has a little time to age before using


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

@CRS yes my tank is heated but the temp did drop last nite outside (even tho the tank temp is at a steady 78 so far) so it's possible that added to the fact that I overfed made him even more stressed.

@John do you think aged water is better? Do you still use prime with it? 

Few hours after water change and things seem to be improving. 

Just noticed my biowheel isn't moving tho.


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

aged water is good as there wont be any chlorine in it for sure after a couple days, especially if you drop an airstone in it while it's sitting. I do not use Prime myself, but I do use Kordon NovAqua Plus Water Conditioner so I don't have the concerns one would with using prime. And I do add it when filling the jug..
As for the wheel on the filter turning, it probably won't if you have the filter in the lowest setting. doesn't take much for them to stop turning with any kind of reduced flow ime.
Almond leaves are something else you should pick up. Very beneficial to Bettas and other fish as it's kinda like natures medicine and can help prevent some things.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

If you have too much ammonia/nitrite then your betta could become listless and if it gets worst he would come up to the surface gasping for air and then he could die. I had one female died due to a high nitrite situation before when I had no idea what cycling meant. Her gill was very red after she died.
The best way to correct the situation, if that is indeed the case, is to do a large water change and add prime and stability.
If you had fed a lot of food you will have lots of left over food in the gravel, which you should remove when you change the water. These food will rot in your tank and result in a high concentration of ammonia and nitrite.
Nitrifying bacteria needs oxygen to work because they are aerobic, so your filter would help as it creates surface aeration. The nitrifying bacteria helps to convert very harmful ammonia to less harmful nitrite. Stability also contains bacteria which can help to decompose the waste in your tank.
You need to check if your betta hates the current from the filter or not, he may be fine with it. I know mine does not mind the current at all. If he does not look like he minds you can adjust the flow till the bio wheel will start moving again. I have never used penguin but from how I understand it the wheele is meant for biological filtration, isn't it?
A slower flow could give you more biological filtration. If you turn it up too much you will get lots of mechanical filtration but because your water does nto stay with the media long enough you will not get much biological filtration.
This is probably not the case as your tank is new but you should also watch out for having too much debris in the filter media which would really slow down the flow. You need to keep track of when you need to change the media.
Good luck.


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## Hollyhawk (Mar 28, 2011)

Even with a heater my guy is a little less active when it is cold. 
Overfeeding can cause problems if the food is rotting. I honestly don't prefer prime, it's hard to measure and smells bad. I still have an old bottle sitting. I switched to the Neutral Regulator 7.0 by seachem. It's easier to add in with a water change than chance killing my fish with an overdose of prime. LOL

Either way I hope all is OK.


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## roadrunner (Apr 25, 2010)

I had one betta stressed out because of the filter current even on the lowest setting. I added this little thing Step-By-Step Filter Baffle and my betta is doing much better.

As for food, I like feeding daphnia once in a while that work pretty much same as peas (laxative), but are much better for bettas. 
You can try adding little bit of aquarium salt, but I wouldn't recommend long term use.

Clean water and stable temperature is very important when keeping bettas. Oh and maybe turn your aquarium light off for day or two and let him rest for a while.


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

Thanks for everyones advice and assistance! He is doing MUCH better, I am happy to report. Had his first boiled and deshelled pea today (a vry small one at that) after a day of fasting, and seemed to enjoy it 

I'm going to try doing the DIY filter thingy for sure.


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## Hollyhawk (Mar 28, 2011)

Sooo glad to hear he is doing betta. LOL


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## missnikki (Dec 28, 2012)

LoL Holly  Me too.


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