# Help needed, plants losing colour and now Green Hair Algae!!!!



## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

Hi, 
I just started my tank 6 weeks ago, but i noticed that now my plants are losing colour.
I am using Flora Base substrate with pressurized Co2 system,
with two 36W 10K Daylight Coralife lamps in 29g biocube.
I checked water conditions with API test kit, its all good.
Fertilizers used were, Dose of Flourish supplement, Dose of Iron and flourish excel

1. Pellia is turning black from one side.
2. Some of the leaves of HC are turning dark green and then transparent.
3. Mermaid weed almost died (turning in reddish black)

Please see attached pics, If you can give any info its appreciated
Thanks


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## Melad360 (Feb 3, 2011)

pellia, its probably rot. you can also see the same thing happening with plants like HC 'cuba' if the growth becomes too dense and packs on top of each other, where the bottom rots and floats up. HC, its probably BGA from what i can see in the pic. if it has a velvety sheen, peels off easily, and has a VILE smell, its BGA. not actually an algae, but a cyanobacteria. mermaid weed, i dunno. i never had it before (i live in Waterloo, On so i dont get cool plants like you lucky peeps at my LFS ).


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

transparent leaves /melting is usually a shock in the plant. could be a sudden spike in nutrient, sudden drastic change in pH. From the information given, we can guess excel is the culprit for the melt since excel technically is an algae-cide and can kill plants if over dose. excel is known to caused pellia to melt.

how much of flourish/iron/excel did you dose?

when you said its all good, what are the parameters?
what is the pH/gH/kH/No3? are you using salt?


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

Yes, they look like they are rotting.
Water parameters are:
Ph 7.2, ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0, Co2 1bps.

As for dosing flourish/iron/excel, all half a cap of small bottle (aprox 4ml) each


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

hmmm the nitrates are really low for a planted tank. Was the flora base used? it lasts about 6 months without needing to use any macro/trace ferts, beyond that you'll need to EI dose, or root tab your plants. if you do need to root tab, you can save a ton of money using Jobes plant spikes (14-4-5). Every couple months just snip some spikes into 3 pieces and plant them deep into the substrate around plants.

another thing is how much and how often do you water change? Your tank might only need minimal changes thanks to there not being any macro ferts added.

Pelia will melt from excel, its very sensative to it. You have pressurized co2, so you don't need the excel dosing. If you wish to keep up the excel as a safegaurd against algae, then you'll need to rid yourself of sensative plants. The co2 sticky mentions plants with sensativities 

Lastly, get a drop checker. It works so much better then using bps as a measurement, as every tank has different demands.


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## Melad360 (Feb 3, 2011)

you can use jobe fertilizer spikes in aquariums? like, the blue ones? i thought those were unsafe because of the dyes and stuff?


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

He is referring to the house plant fertilizer stick.. i.e. lush ferns and palm type. Not the outdoor tree fertilizer spike. Those are way too big.

If you are adding CO2, I would hold back on the excel. look for a source of nitrate and phosphate because you have a lot of lights and no NPK (macro nutrients for the plants)


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## kelownaguy (Jan 1, 2011)

I thought the jobe fertilizer spikes were unsafe because of the ammonium content.
That said,I use them in my pond.

+1 on adding some NPKs


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

i've used them for almost 2 years, others have used them 5+ years without issues. Most complaints about the spike not completely dissolving, it leaves these light white chunks in the substrate (the holding material) after its used up, but if some comes to the surface it is very easily vacuumed up. 

With any root tab (and florabase, MTS, similar substrates), you can experience algae blooms IF you mess around the substrate too much. I move around Stems, uproot area's of foreground, and now and then remove a crypt or lotus plant and never have had this happen though. So if you decide to put a spike in the substrate around some stems, move somewhere near by the stem, under a rock or driftwood next to it, or just off the corner, where your tongs wont be messing about often. 

Now if you are never happy with plant placement, don't get the spikes, EI dose and save the hassle. Why? because these spikes are meant for terrestial plants, they contain urea (2%), which is ammonia in water, and can cause an algae outbreak if you disturb them too much at once. So if you have a ton of stems, only use them under heavy rooted non stem plants, because you'll likely not move those, but the stems will be uprooted often. As i said early, hiding them deepunder driftwood you never move, or hardscape like rocks nearby stems will still be beneficial to those plants. Now why would we still use them? they work exceptionally well with plants, they don't harm livestock when used properly, and they are ridiculously cheap and easy to use.

the sticks are very thin, cost a $1-$3 per pack and come in many varieties. The ideal type is lush ferns and palms jobes (16-2-6), but sometimes its hard to find that kind so the houseplants (13-4-5) will suffice.

Flora base does have npk within it, but these will help extend the life of your substrate at little extra cost. unless you want to go EI dosing, this is probably your best bet.


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## Melad360 (Feb 3, 2011)

cool... i move my stems a lot lol. but i have this GIANT 16" sword that i dont move... maybe i will use some there. can i use one entire stick for it or do i have to cut it up?


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

I break the sticks in 1/2 and plant 2 spike for bigger echinodorus. If you use jobes stick, this is more in line of the walstad natural method than EI method since you are relying on substrate to do the work. 

I stay away from using plant spike with foreground and stems. a matured mulm built up gravel bed will serve the same purpose.

Aquarium Pharm root tabs is potassium and trace element. there is no N and P to cause algae bloom. If you go with jobes stick, you want them at least 1.5" below the gravel to keep the ammonia from leeching to the water column.

Seachem nitrogen contains urea, which is ammonia. There is no problem with small dosing if your filter is matured to convert NH3 and NH4 fast enough.


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

i did water change today about 15% after 3 weeks, i used 2 bags of flora base, one was brand new and other one was opened by me 8 months ago to use some in my 3 gallon tank (i tried to seal it by melting plastic bag) 
So using tabs will help i guess, will it increase nitrates in my tank ?? just curious how nitrates are produced naturally in tank.


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

nitrate is produced by fish waste, left over food, rotting plant, and etc (organic waste) through the process of the nitrogen cycle. NH3 > NH4 > NO2 > NO3.

If you buried the sticks deep into the gravel, you shouldn't get any Nitrogen leeching into the water column that quickly.


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

Now there is another problem i am facing.
Its green hair algae, which is developing all over in tank and plants.
its green thin hair like strings.
My tank is close to window, would that create a problem (there is no driect light coming though)

Can you please sugest how to get rid of it?
Should i try doing blackout for 4-5 days??

Please help


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

Too much Iron can caused green hair algae. I can't really tell what algae you have from the photo. Does it look like hair algae in the below link?

http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_freshwater_algae.php

Did you change anything recently?


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

Hello there,
No major change done in tank, i removed rotting plants and added more ferts to provide nutritents. I did add iron as HC leaves were turning yellow from edges. 
water parameters Ph 7, ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0, Co2 2bps.

Yes, it looks same like hair algae as shown in this website, its like single thin strings. 
I cleaned algae from the tank and trimmed some algae from plants, also trimmed some of HC as algae was building up on HC.
"Pic is just to show the place of tank as its placed close to a window" I read somewhere that tanks placed close to window can have algae problems????


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

Yellowing on the edges of leaves, normally, isn't iron deficiency. If you see veining on new growth, that is iron deficiency.

Yellowing from edges on HC is *usually* nitrate or trace deficiency. Does the leaves look like it is being eaten away?

There is no 100% fool proof way without doing lab test to say what is the caused because a deficiency in one nutrient or an excess in another nutrient can triggered the deficiency.

Tank place near Window doesn't always lead to algae problem. Algae is less problematic in a very clean water tank.


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

ok, thats good to know. 
No, leaves dosent look like eaten away but some of them look like dark green and rotting.
So should i just dose flourish for plant nutrient. 
and Should i also do blackout to get rid of Hair algae??
And maybe shut co2 off for couple days


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

don't have to blackout to get rid of hair algae, cut back dosing trace and Iron. Once every few days for trace should be fine. 

If they are rotting, then most likely nitrate deficiency. You have a lot of light without adding Macro nutrients N-P-K. Are you adding anything for gH?

are you adding excel or stopped adding excel?


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

I stopped adding excel due to rotting problem, since last 2 days i also reduced lighting timings. So now i should regular dosing trace, flourish.
and i am not adding anything for gH. Should i stop co2 for some days???


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

No. not regular dosing of trace, flourish, or iron. Do that once every few days at most.

You need Nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium and gH.


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

Good to know, so i will buy these individual nutritents (as i dont have them)

Just another question should i keep co2 running or should i shut it off for some days??


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

keep CO2 running,

ADD: You should look into using potassium nitrate and mono potassium phosphate to lower the cost.

http://www.bcaquaria.com/forum/plants-algae-ferts-ei-co2-lighting-13/intro-ei-estimated-index-82/

You can skip potassium sulphate if you don't have a lot of fish.


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

I guess i should contact a local Hydroponic store to buy these fertz? or is there another better option, Are they expensive?


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

They are dirt cheap if you buy the dry chemicals.

I bought mine 3-4 years ago and i still haven't run out. $15 goes a long ways


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

Cheapest is through aquaflora nurseries.


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## RDonald (Apr 25, 2010)

I just received my shipment of dry ferts from AquariumFertilizer.com. Took 6 business days from the US. The flat rate shipping to Canada was $15 but quite honestly the convenience was well worth it. They even ship Potassium Nitrate which I've heard is getting harder to buy locally?


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

its harder to find someone who wants to ship it cross border, easier to get locally though imo.


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## kverma (Nov 29, 2010)

Well i tried couple hydroponic stores in Surrey and Burnaby, but they dont have these fertilizers. Can anyone please suggest where can i get them locally.


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## EDGE (Aug 24, 2010)

aquaflora nurseries, one of the sponsor on here.


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