# 120g malawi tank



## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Was going to put this in the pic section but i'm hoping to keep this going for all my question  just set this up today. I tore down my 75g and was going to give it to a friend but once i cleaned it out, i realized it would need to be re-sealed and we figured it wouldnt be worth the effort  ...this is my 120 and planning on keeping malawi cichlids. I'll be filling it with river rocks and hopefully be getting my blue cobalt into her new home sometime this week. I hope the pics work as i'm doing this from my iphone...


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

You are going to have lots of fun with Africans. They are very active and love to be fed


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Ya i can hardly wait for the feeding frenzy  i put in the river rocks tonite and WOW i need a lot more...heres a pic of it so far...hopefully all these rocks are ok. I checked my params and they are all good...ammonia 0, nitrates 0 ph 8.5 ( little high) i will check again tomorrow and may be able to move my fish back over


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## IceBlue (Mar 17, 2011)

Looking good. I see you have a glass heater. I went through 2 or 3 before I went to a hydor in line heater.So much action they kept breaking the glass heaters. Might be a problem fitting it with your filter. Looks like the FX5 with the 1" hose. May be other remedies but just a heads up


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Ya its a glass heater but warmed up the water pretty quick...better than my old one. That inline one looks cool and sure i could make it fit but its only rated up to 80g well at least the ones i was just looking at...if i stick the heater right in the corner or horizontal on the bottom it might last longer


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## Sidius (Mar 25, 2012)

You can get a non glass heater from J&L for pretty cheap.. I actually went with 2 smaller heaters just because it's supposed to be safer if one malfunctions. They usually malfunction in the on position if it happens so a smaller heater will take longer to over heat the water if that happens. They were only about $40 each from J&L (I bought the 150w heaters but you may want 2x200w)

Aqueon Pro Aquarium Heater (200 Watt)


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## Sidius (Mar 25, 2012)

You should start a tank journal for this so you can keep it updated with pics over time! You can always link to it when you have questions. It's always nice to see updates on a tank after a year or so in the journals section. Plus you can see how it develops. Either way, great job on the rock work. Your Mbuna's should love it.


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## dino (Aug 29, 2011)

Ive got a question? Are you going to keep the black sand? Just wondering because when people keep discus with black sand they seem to be a little less bright in colour i was.wondering if this will be the same with africans? Plus i used some kind of buffer type sand to keep ph up


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Sidius - ya i may be switching out the heaters once i get some fish in it...i do like buying new stuff  i had a non glass heater before but it didnt have a light to tell me if it was working...it wasnt  i am keeping my pics and will be starting a journal eventually...i'm not sold on the rock work...definetely not an aquascape artist but we'll see how my mbunas like it...at those cost me $15 and have a few more i could put in...

Dino - the black sand is actually the african eco-complete and its called zack black...and its "supposed" to buffer the water and hopefully keep my ph up  i was checking my kh (196ppm) and my Gh but i think my test liquid is for the GH is old as i put in 50 drops and the clour never changed...same went for my tap water...thank god i have another test kit


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

I have 2 glass heaters and lots of fish in my tank and havnt had a problem. Not to say it couldnt happen but thats why I run 2. 

As for your water the problem probably isnt the test kit. Most likely you have no GH as the tap water in Langley seems to have little to know GH. If you want to come by and check out my setup and here my knowledge on Africans feel free to stop by. I bought the same substrate as you just a different version.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

You're right...used my other test and after 1 drop the colour changed so i'm at like GH 20ppm and KH 90ppm. I added some more malawi/victoria buffer and cichlid salt and will test again tomorrow. My ph is still around 8.5 and no ammonia or nitrate so thats good. I want to get my cobalt blue in ASAP...I see you live close so maybe i will pop by one day


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Viper007 said:


> You're right...used my other test and after 1 drop the colour changed so i'm at like GH 20ppm and KH 90ppm. I added some more malawi/victoria buffer and cichlid salt and will test again tomorrow. My ph is still around 8.5 and no ammonia or nitrate so thats good. I want to get my cobalt blue in ASAP...I see you live close so maybe i will pop by one day


I live in Walnut Grove. Checking out other peoples setups is how I learned so I enjoy passing it on.

I had the same problem when I first started testing KH and GH. I couldnt figure out why I had to add so many drops. So I stoped using them for awhile. The API test kit I have can be tough to tell when the color changes from orange to green. Adding malawi buffer and cichlid salt wont help with increasing GH they will increase PH & KH. I have plants in my African tank so I use Equilibrium SeaChem Equilibrium - 600 Gram. to raise my GH. Im not sure if this is what other people are using. It works for me. If your PH is at 8.5 thats a little high IMO. Dont add anymore Malawi buffer. Your next water change will bring the PH down a little. Trying to maintain a high ph can be a pain and you will be adding more of the buffer than you would if you kept it a little lower. I will post a chart I found on African water later tonight. Its on my computer at home. I try not to stay to focused on the Ph# rather I try to make sure it stays around the same. My tank is usually around 7.3 to 7.6 . I do keep it lower because of plants but I find it easier to maintain a lower number rather than a higher. There is lots to learn when keeping Africans. Im sure others have different views. You are in for a fun journey.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Ya i love looking at other ppls tanks...get good ideas  i'm gonna put a couple of bags of crushed coral in my tank as well as a few pcs of rock (coral pcs i think). I read that epsom salt will raise the GH without affecting the KH...i'll try that as well. If that doesnt work i might be heading to the states this weekend and i'll maybe pick up some equilibrium. Dont have plants...yet  And ya, i know that PH is high and will be bringing that down with more water. I havent fully filled the tank yet. Want the water right and soon as my poor fishy is stuck in my 5g  was hoping to have her in her new tank sooner...


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

So i yesterday i added 3 tbsp of epsom salt and 1 tbsp of baking soda and now my GH is 140 ppm, KH is 80 ppm and PH is 8.0 . I will repeat this now and hopefully tomorrow my params should be good...i'd use the malawi buffer and cichlid salt but not use to them yet


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## Sidius (Mar 25, 2012)

Viper007 said:


> Sidius - ya i may be switching out the heaters once i get some fish in it...i do like buying new stuff  i had a non glass heater before but it didnt have a light to tell me if it was working...it wasnt


I have two of the heaters I sent you the links for at J&L and they definitely have a light. It's green when the right temp and red when the heater is actually heating the water.

JB is right, you may never have any issues with glass. I bought mine just simply as a precaution because I read some horror stories about broken heaters with Africans and also because the black plastic blends in with my painted black background so I don't really see them other than the light. I haven't personally had them break a glass heater. Although I have had them break a glass thermometer lol


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Ya that heater would blend in nicely with my black sand  i'd might need 2 of them if winter ever comes  the room i have both my tanks in is always pretty warm so might be able to get away with one...the one i have in there now is set for 76 but the water is at 80...i just keep turning it down but its so hot in that room...will hopefully get my blue cobalt in her new tank today  then i'll be asking the stocking questions...


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Heres a little update for all...i have my 3 yellow labs, 3 red zebras and 1 adult and 1 juvie blue cobalt. They all get along real well and the tank still looks good  i feed them them mostly flake food and spirina flakes. Now i just need some suggestions on some other tankmates. I see someone selling some blue johannis...


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## dino (Aug 29, 2011)

i like it goog job i love the rocks and just my info i have limestone and some coral in my tank and it seems to keep ph up all the time. i find it cool we can keep africans and discus with our water and by the way i dont bother buffering and ive raised lots african fry and my tank healthy. keep listening to jbyoung and youll be good


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## Vman (Jan 20, 2011)

Tank looks good.If you want your water to be good and never have to do tests,just add 1 tbsp of Epsom salt,1 tbsp of marine salt and 1 tsp of baking soda per every 10 gallons. I've been doing this method for a few years ,as well as my friends,and we've raised Tropheus(top difficult Cichlid to keep),Calvus,Compressiceps and Petricolas.I think that your sand is the problem. If you had all Arrogonite throughout the tank your water would be much better.If you like black then you can get black Arrogonite or stuff one filter full of it if you don't want to change your whole tank around.There are lots of things you can buy and keep playing with your water chemistry,but that seems like a pain in the arse.Give this a try,it won't hurt,and you'll see. Good luck.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Thanks for the props everyone  as for my water, the gh & kh is still below what i want but my ph is 8.0 and holding test after test. I have the eco complete african cichlid sand, a piece of texas holey, tufa, z-lite and river rocks. I use the malawi/victoria buffer and cichlid salt right now. I might look into the argonite but can i just add it into one of my trays in my FX5 (in bags)? I know i shouldnt worry about the gh and kh as much as the ph but still want it as close to natural as possible. I will continue to experiment and hopefully get it right one day  i would prefer not having to add a dozen different additives


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## MOLOTO (Jun 8, 2010)

> If you want your water to be good and never have to do tests,just add 1 tbsp of Epsom salt,1 tbsp of marine salt and 1 tsp of baking soda per every 10 gallons.


+1, Ever since Lukasz gave me this buffer recipe my fish have never been better! Be sure to give this a try, it works trust me!


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## Vman (Jan 20, 2011)

Thanks Brandon.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Viper007 said:


> Thanks for the props everyone  as for my water, the gh & kh is still below what i want but my ph is 8.0 and holding test after test. I have the eco complete african cichlid sand, a piece of texas holey, tufa, z-lite and river rocks. I use the malawi/victoria buffer and cichlid salt right now. I might look into the argonite but can i just add it into one of my trays in my FX5 (in bags)? I know i shouldnt worry about the gh and kh as much as the ph but still want it as close to natural as possible. I will continue to experiment and hopefully get it right one day  i would prefer not having to add a dozen different additives


Tank looks really good. Lots of room for fish now  Im probably going to be getting rid of my trio of Fuellebornis if you are interested in them. The male is blue. The 2 females are OB color Im waiting for one of the females to hold babies again so I can have a few. Than Im looking to get rid of them the group. Male Johanni's can get mean. Some people will only keep females since they are a nice yellow color anyways. We had A male at the pet store I worked at and we couldnt put any fish with him. Just a heads up.

Im pretty sure the African cichlid sand you have is a form of aragonite or atleast it does the same thing. I cant find anything that says its aragonite but there is info on the webpage saying why the African substrate helps with water chemistry. Eco-Complete Cichild
So adding a small bag of aragonite to your filter might be wasting space and slow it down a bit. IMO It would be better to add more biomedia since most people keep their tanks well stocked so more never hurts.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

i was using the epsom salt and and baking soda mixture with my old 75g but havent used the marine salt. My fish never had a problem. Will that mixture give them the proper trace elements that the cichlids require? I though i needed the cichlid salt to ensure they got all those eminerals?


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## Sidius (Mar 25, 2012)

I noticed you said you shouldn't worry about GH/KH as much as PH but in my opinion is the opposite. If you maintain your GH/KH then your PH should stay stable in the range you're looking for. I also agree with JB that adding aragonite to your filter tray, uses up space that you could have for bio media. It's much easier to buffer your water and have extra bio media, in my opinion. You have the option to buffer your water, you don't really have the option to add bio to your water, aside from your media trays.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

dino said:


> i like it goog job i love the rocks and just my info i have limestone and some coral in my tank and it seems to keep ph up all the time. i find it cool we can keep africans and discus with our water and by the way i dont bother buffering and ive raised lots african fry and my tank healthy. keep listening to jbyoung and youll be good


Thanks Dino. How are the fish doing that I sold you? Im saying my opinions and what Ive learned or read from so many others. We all do stuff are own way. What ever works right!


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Viper007 said:


> i was using the epsom salt and and baking soda mixture with my old 75g but havent used the marine salt. My fish never had a problem. Will that mixture give them the proper trace elements that the cichlids require? I though i needed the cichlid salt to ensure they got all those eminerals?


We have had the debate a few times on here about what works best for buffering water. I know Vman and Moloto like their own home brews. Sidius and I prefer the seachem products. If you are already adding a form of salt than adding Seachem lake salt might make your water have too much salt??? I dont know enough about the home brews to say if its a good idea to mix the lake salt with the other salts. It cant hurt. I measure my salt content with a hydrometer. Some say its not needed but IMO if Im adding salt to my tank I want to be able to know how much Im adding. Off the top of my head I think Lake Malawi has a salt content of 1.008. I have a link saved at home that talks about the lakes water chemistry. I can post it later. I have been using the Seachem African mixes only and I just ran out of both my bottles at the same time and I had them for 4.5 months. So its cost me around $25. I do a 50% water change so 60gallons once a week to give you an idea of how long these products can last. After all my years of fish keeping I have discovered doing things the proper way no mickey mouse stuff works better. Nothing against the home brews Vman and Moloto. I like to set it all up righ the first time. Add the proper products and you dont have as many problems. No random tank crashes, parasittes or algea. Just my opinion. Your tank is coming along great. Keep doing whatever works best for YOU. Their doesnt seem to be a right answer when it comes to keeping African water.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

JB - sorry i must have missed your post  as for your Fuellebornis, keep me posted and i'll let you know. I'm still trying to decide what else i want in my tank. And yes i've read that the johannis can be quite aggressive so i may pass on those. So i will not add anything but bio media to my filter, instead i will find some black argonite and add it directly to my aquarium. Do you know where to get some?

Sidius - I didn't mean to say i'm not worried about the GH/KH, i just meant as long as my PH was maintaining that it wasn't as important (that sound right?) I am trying to raise them both and will continue and will make sure my PH stays level. 

I will pick up some of the marine salt and try the rift lake recipe and see how that goes. Which marine salt should i be using?


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## Vman (Jan 20, 2011)

Instant ocean marine salt is what I'm using. It's about $13 for a bag at J&L. Don't forget that a lot of Benefitial bacteria also live in the substrate. I've got about 3" of arogonite in my tank. The black arogonite and all other Cichlid substrates are available from Caribsea. Just go on the website and download their catalogue.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

So i did some more research and found that my zack black eco-complete does in fact contain arogonite so i'm on the right track. I havent decided if i want to use the rift lake recipe or continue to use my seachem products...i've used both and had no problem with either. My only problem is getting my gh and kh up without bringing my ph to high. Guess its just a matter of preference. I'm glad i didnt start a SW tank as i'm having enough problems with my cichlids...they all look and act fine so i'll just keep experementing until i come up with the perfect mix...


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## Sidius (Mar 25, 2012)

Viper007 said:


> Sidius - I didn't mean to say i'm not worried about the GH/KH, i just meant as long as my PH was maintaining that it wasn't as important (that sound right?) I am trying to raise them both and will continue and will make sure my PH stays level.


It definitely sounds right  ... I didn't mean to imply that you were wrong, my apologies if I did. Essentially we're saying the same thing lol.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Viper007 said:


> So i did some more research and found that my zack black eco-complete does in fact contain arogonite so i'm on the right track. I havent decided if i want to use the rift lake recipe or continue to use my seachem products...i've used both and had no problem with either. My only problem is getting my gh and kh up without bringing my ph to high. Guess its just a matter of preference. I'm glad i didnt start a SW tank as i'm having enough problems with my cichlids...they all look and act fine so i'll just keep experementing until i come up with the perfect mix...


I thought your caribsea was a form of aragonite. Where did you find info saying it was? I have the Carib sea African mix aswell but a different type.
As for your ph/kh/gh. That will become easier with time. It doesnt have to be perfect its more important that it stays relatively the same after each water change. You will figure it all out eventually. If the fish seem happy you are on the right track.

Stuff those filters full of bio media. LOL. I have 5 different kinds in my 2 canister filters. Who knows what works best???? So I chose them all. You might want to leave one tray empty incase you want to add something else later on or if you use a hang on filter you can always add something to it instead like an ammonia sponge or peat or carbon to periodically clean the water.

I will let you know when Im selling my fuellebornis. I would keep them but they are eating some of my plants the little buggers.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Sidius - i know what you meant  i am working on raising my kh and gh so no appologies neccessary...we're all striving for the same thing...happy fish &#55357;&#56836;

JB - heres a site that states my zack black sand contains aragonite...i am running just my FX 5 in my 120 and have ceramic bio rings, a filter pad, a gloss pad and some carbon in it right now...carbon will be remove at my fist filter cleaning. Hope thats enough filtration and stuff in it...

Caribsea Eco-Complete - Cichlid Zack Black - Cichlid Substrate


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

You dont have many fish so filtration wont be a problem right now. IMO look into adding more biomedia as you get more fish and remove the extra pads in the fx5. Some of the polishing pads really slow down the Fx5 rather quickly because they clog up so fast. Africans love to eat which can be messy thats why lots of guys run a type of HOB filter to help polish the water. I use my fx5 and rena purely for biomedia but I do have the standard foam pads in both. I also run a marineland hot magnum. Marineland HOT Magnum Hang On Tank Convertible Canister Filter at PETCO. It can be used as a water polisher or you can add carbon or whatever else you want every now and than to help clean up the water. The filter is easy to clean. I bleach it than soak it in water conditioner over night. Its been so efective that I bought another micron filter for it and alternate them. Mine clogs up every 5 days since I have so many fish but its amazing what the micron filter catches. It help keeps my water crystal clear and its way easier to clean than my fx5. Its also moves a lot of water along the surface which helps pervide new oxygen for the fish. Just some suggestions to keep in mind. Im not saying go run out and buy a new filter or anything im just sharing my experiences


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Well i have no problem buying more equipment  the one type of shopping i like...i do have 2 XP3 just sitting here so i may hook 1 up when i get stocked and i have heard a lot of ppl use the HOT filters for polishing and that one looks good  i only have 1 pad of each in my trays right now and some nylons filled with carbon and the rings in the top tray...what other media do you use? So far my water is chrystal clear but if i see some cloudyness like my other tank, a shopping i will go


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Viper007 said:


> Well i have no problem buying more equipment  the one type of shopping i like...i do have 2 XP3 just sitting here so i may hook 1 up when i get stocked and i have heard a lot of ppl use the HOT filters for polishing and that one looks good  i only have 1 pad of each in my trays right now and some nylons filled with carbon and the rings in the top tray...what other media do you use? So far my water is chrystal clear but if i see some cloudyness like my other tank, a shopping i will go


The bio medias I am using are Eheim Substrat Pro, Fluval Biomax, Seachem Matrix, No name ceramic rings, Rena Bio stars and ones that look like crutons. I cant remember the name. Bought it at j&L. I dont know if one works better than the other. The more biomedia the better. On my 25g I have a fluval 304 fully filled with biomedia aswell. Its over stocked with fish too. LOL. You might already know that carbon is good for removing smell, color and medication from water. Other than that its not really needed to run all the time. I run carbon for 4 or 5 days every couple of months as Ive mentioned in my HOB filter. Without all the bio media in my filters Im sure my water quality would be terrible. Im definitely a fish hoarder.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

That is quite a bit of bio media. You also have the foam pads? I like that seachem and eheim stuff so maybe i'll pick some of that up. I picked up a few synodontis petricolas today so i should start thinking about setting up my XP3 with some of that and some foam pads. When i clean my filter next time i will make sure i fill it with more bio media and maybe have more mechanical media in the XP3. So many decisions  and as for the carbon, i just kinda threw it in as i had a big tub of carbon and filled sone nylons but i knew it would just be short term and just wanted to fill my canister.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

I use the foam pads that are provided. In the fx5 I use the foam that goes arounf the circle trays. In the center of all the circle trays I run Bio media only. In the rena xp3 I use 3 of the black foam blocks that come with it. They provide 4 but I find 3 works good enough. 4 seems to slow the water flow down. The other 2 trays I have full of bio media. It does seeem like a lot of media but I have over 50+ Africans.

I want Petricolas. They are really nice. They do best in groups. If you are looking for more PM Cypho on here. He breeds them. Hopefully I will buy some in the next month or 2. 

I was just giving a heads up on the carbon. Some people run it all the time and theres nothing wrong with that its just not necessary.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Ya i kinda forgot that the fx5 has all that foam on the outside. I will definetely be picking up more biomedia on mu next shopping trip ...i do plan on stocking the 120g so i will make sure my xp3 is full of bio and some foam as well. 

I like the synodontis's as well but i wasnt really looking for them when i went to rogers but they only had 1 acei  i wanted at least 3 so didnt want to make it a wasted trip  and props for Rogers for having a really sweet selection of plants, i will be returning once i figure out what i want in my 65g...sorry i didnt get them from you Cypho but i will next time if your reading 

As for the carbon, i was just using it for filler and since it was a new tank with half full of old and new water i figured it couldnt hurt but i know to get it out of there before it starts seeping everything back into my tank.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Hows the tank looking? Any new Pictures? Are all the fish getting along?

Im a huge fan of Rogers. I bought a 48g tank from him 16 years ago when I was a kid and his shop was called Perky's pets. His store always has very healthy plants with good roots and his fish are always healthy too. Since I moved to Langley I dont visit his store as much anymore.


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

Well...most of my fish are great except for my adult female cobalt. I submitted this in the hospital section but if anyone here knows. It looks like either a big huge white poop or her intestines are coming out...pic added


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## Viper007 (Jul 24, 2012)

It seems that piece has subsided and just a piece of poop there now...i will keep an eye on her and let her fast for a few days...phew


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## KVD88 (Jul 21, 2010)

Hey there, I thought reading this thread that I'd ask a question the the "home brew" side water buffering. For the epsom salt part, One time I added it (as recommended here and many other places on line) and my water got a bit murkey and I ended up losing 4 fish. My PH went up to 8.5. I've been trigger shy ever since on the home brew stuff. Yes I was careful on the right ratio/gal and quantities, etc. Here's the root of the question though…On the epsom salt lable, it says below it in smaller font "bath salts" I dont know if there is a variety of other epsom salt types, but thought it was all basically Magnesium Sulfate.
Any input would be helpful, thanks!


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## Vman (Jan 20, 2011)

You have to make sure that it is 100% pure.Ive been using the Epsom salt from Costco for a couple of years now.Ive never expierienced murkey water. If you do the Baking soda,marine salt and Epsom mix ,and wait too long then it kind of clumps. I've left the mix over night before and it turned murkey.As soon I added it with my water change it was fine.Myself and 4 of my friends all do this mix and all is well.Fish are breeding and no sickness.What is the mix that you are following?


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