# Experience with buying a used car...your thoughts



## jobber (May 14, 2010)

This is not revscene, but since I respect some of the opinions of members on this forum, I'd like to hear of other members' experience buying a used car.

Have you ever purchased a used car? 
Did you buy from a dealership or one of those Kingsway/King George "dealership"?
Did you buy from a private seller or dealership?
Were you able to talk down the price of the advertised price of the used car? and by how much?
Did you have a positive or negative experience?
Any mechanical issues with your vehicle soon after your purchased the used car?
If you had to do it all over again, would you buy used or spend that extra money and buy a new car?
Would you buy a car with more than 100,000km?


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## Death's Sting (Apr 21, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> This is not revscene, but since I respect some of the opinions of members on this forum, I'd like to hear of other members' experience buying a used car.
> 
> Have you ever purchased a used car?
> Yes
> ...


See the red for answers ^

I recommend bringing a mechanic with you and getting him to do a full certification of the vehicle. BCAA with do this for about $150-200.

In 2009, I bought a 2008 fully loaded Civic for $12K with 7K Km on it.


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Death's Sting said:


> See the red for answers ^
> 
> I recommend bringing a mechanic with you and getting him to do a full certification of the vehicle. BCAA with do this for about $150-200.
> 
> In 2009, I bought a 2008 fully loaded Civic for $12K with 7K Km on it.


that's a really good deal considering it's a one year old car with low km. You definitely scored a good deal in this respect.


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

always always bring a mechanic. 
you have no idea what the seller might be hiding.

and yes this is not revscene. if it was youd get trolled by now. HAHA


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

I bought my old 89 V6 convertible Toyota 4-Runner from a "dealership" on Kingsway back in the 90s. I was able to talk them down from $17999 to $13000. I left a $500 deposit and hired BCAA to do a 90 point check. The deal was written up as contingent on passing the BCAA inspection and that they would repair or replace any defects the inspector found. It worked great for a long time and was great as a 4x4 when I lived 20km up an active logging road in Powell River at a fish farm. I taught myself to make repairs (with the help of a mechanic friend) so repairs were inexpensive for the most part. The most expensive repair was having my entire shock system replaced but that was my own fault since I used to "jump" my truck to see how far I could get all four tires off the road (kids, don't do this). My vehicle was actually quite low mileage (bought in 93 with under 50000k on it. It only gave me trouble after it was stolen and the thieves damaged the engine a bit before they abandoned it and stole my BF Goodrich All-Terrains (31"). I ended up giving it to my "little brother" (whom I had done an unofficial Big Bro program with before he moved to Winnipeg). I made him a deal that if he flew here for my wedding and was my Best Man, I would give him my 4-Runner to drive home. 

Now I drive a Honda CRV bought new. It was about $27000+fees, so about double. But its been an excellent vehicle. 

I think if you're willing to do your own repairs or you buy a reliable Honda, then used is a good, less expensive option.

I would also have a mechanic friend come with you or hire BCAA to do a 90 point inspection before you buy any vehicle used.


Hope this helps,

Anthony


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## Death's Sting (Apr 21, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> that's a really good deal considering it's a one year old car with low km. You definitely scored a good deal in this respect.


This is exactly the reason I prefer used, if your quick and clever enough you save thousands. The only down side is that its a gamble really; ESPECIALLY if you don't get the car inspected, I cant stress this enough.

You gamble with availability, price, personal/social experience, color and most importantly vehicle reliability.

To help your odds:
-Bring a mechanic
-Don't be picky about color; choose a few you would accept
-Bring cash
-Ask for documentation
-write up a contract
-Bring friends and family for security and opinions
-If you feel uncomfortable walk away


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

BaoBeiZhu said:


> always always bring a mechanic.
> you have no idea what the seller might be hiding.
> 
> and yes this is not revscene. if it was youd get trolled by now. HAHA


I was on revscene many years ago..probably close to 10 years ago. After a few months on it, I gave up on it and the rice rockets during the youth ;D

Not sure even if the mechanic will find everything wrong with it. But better be safe than sorry.



SeaHorse_Fanatic said:


> I bought my old 89 V6 convertible Toyota 4-Runner from ....
> 
> I think if you're willing to do your own repairs or you buy a reliable Honda, then used is a good, less expensive option.
> 
> ...


Great info Anthony. So you've had import compact SUV. I'm thinking to make the switch from import to domestic.
I've just heard so many horror stories, but as long as i do my own homework and talk down the price about $2000 to buffer against any potential repairs, then I'll be safe. I just had my shocks replaced on my civic, bought the parts from the states and installed by my mechanic. BUY PARTS FROM THE STATES!!!! It's so much cheaper.


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## Alkatraz (Jul 20, 2012)

+1 take it to an independent mechanic you trust

If the seller will allow, get a compression test/leak down test. This isn't included in the basic vehicle inspection and will tell you if the engine needs a rebuild.

I wouldnt personally buy from a used car dealer. They are selling for profit whereas a private seller is typically selling to get rid of their car. (bought a new one, changing locations, don't want to invest more into the vehicle)

Everything on a vehicle can be fixed except rust and unibody damage. Stay away from rust and rebuilds. 

Beware of transmission rebuilds. The reason it required a rebuild in the first place may not be resolved and the rebuild may not be done well. See if there are receipts and a warranty in place with the rebuilder, make sure that warranty will transfer to a new owner. Transmissions are the 2nd most expensive thing to replace after the engine.

Look for vehicles that have had big maintenance already done. (timing belt, water pump, etc) not only do you not have to pay to do it, you know the car hasn't been neglected which could cause premature engine probs. Research the scheduled maintenance on the vehicle you're looking at so you know what should have been done and will be required next. (the mechanic will tell you but do this before you go with a mechanic to save some money)

Ive only ever purchased used. I bought a 95 pathfinder with 175k km for $2k last year. Everything had already been done by previous owner, got that checked of course, and it's been great ever since.

I wouldn't buy a domestic with more than 50k personally. It's like they design parts to fail on those things past 100k km.

Best of luck!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

Djamm bought a new Civic a few years ago. It's been a great car, and the upside to the higher initial price is the lack of maintenance/repair costs. We actually rented a newer model of Civic on a trip the other weekend, and it wasn't nearly as nice as our 5 year old model.

We bought our pickup truck used (but well taken care of) a year ago from a reputable dealer in Mission. We saved many, many thousands off the price by purchasing a 5 year old vehicle versus a new one, and it's been awesome. It's a diesel, so the mileage was less of an issue than it would have been on a gas truck. We did however get a really intensive inspection done and I've still put more money into regular maintenance on it than we did on the car.

Here are some rules that I live by:


Know what you NEED. This sounds like a no-brainer, but buying a hot sports car because your buddy loves his, even though he has no kids and you have 3, is not always a good idea!
Research, research, research. Know everything about the vehicle you want before you set out looking. Know about problems specific to that vehicle and ask about them.

Ask lots of questions. LOTS. And if you get evasive answers or half-truths, you're done right there.

Get the ICBC history on the vehicle. Ask for details on out of province stuff as well.

Be patient and don't jump on the first vehicle that comes along. Wait for what really meets your needs. We were looking for nearly 3 months before we found my truck.

Have a budget and stick to it. No exceptions. If you're close, many dealers will come down to your price to make a sale if you show you're ready to walk.

Get a good mechanic whom you trust to do a really thorough inspection. If you don't know a good mechanic, get BCAA. Any offer should be contingent on the vehicle passing inspection.

 (added) If it's not in writing, in a signed contract, it doesn't exist and can't be enforced. Get EVERYTHING in writing.

Be ready to walk away, and really mean it. Half of what a used car salesman will tell you is crap, and the other half is exaggerated at best. High pressure sales tactics are an instant deal breaker for me as well - if you're so desperate to get rid of it that you're berating your customers, something doesn't pass the sniff test.


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## Lamplighter (Aug 3, 2012)

My neighbor bought a '07 F150 in the beginning of the year. The engine blew. It cost 7K to repair but he had bought some kind of insurance that paid for the engine.


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

You can get "replacement" insurance if the car isn't too old. May be worth investing in depending on the vehicle.


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

Yikes! Yes, I think as Elle said, you can buy extended warranties on used cars, especially if you buy it from a dealer. Believe me, they will try to sell you big time on the policies. I think the one I had turned down when my wife bought her Pathfinder was a 3 year deal where you actually would get your cash back if you don't claim on it.

On a side note, my buddy is looking at a brand new F150 right now and the dealer is offering 25% off MSRP. That's crazy....what kind of mark up do they have on cars anyways????



Lamplighter said:


> My neighbor bought a '07 F150 in the beginning of the year. The engine blew. It cost 7K to repair but he had bought some kind of insurance that paid for the engine.


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## target (Apr 21, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> This is not revscene, but since I respect some of the opinions of members on this forum, I'd like to hear of other members' experience buying a used car.
> 
> Have you ever purchased a used car?
> Yes, 2 different times
> ...


My response


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## ThePhoenix (Jul 23, 2012)

I have worked at 2 lower mainland NEW car dealerships starting as a lot attendant, driving the shuttle, doing prep work and delivery in the bodyshop, delivering parts and finally as a mechanic.

Based on my experiences there and dealing with the used car salesmen that came in to buy our used cars/trade-ins I would never NEVER *NEVER* buy a car from a used car dealership. Buying a used car from a new car dealership is ok. Everything you have ever heard about used car dealerships IS TRUE. From buying new odometers to lie about the mileage, painting over rust, replacing defective parts with used, untested parts. Anything you have ever read about or seen in a movie, I have seen them do. They are the slimiest, dirtiest, crafty, shady, sneaky, lying, say-absolutely-anything to get you-to-sign-the-dotted-line shysters, and I would discourage you and anyone else from doing business with them.

Granted you could get the same from craigslist private sellers, but most people are not shady and will tell the truth. Also, if its too good to be true, DONT BUY IT!

I have bought and sold 15 cars, all from craigslist, and no one has ever ripped me off. I used to curb cars for fun back in the day, but I dont have a house anymore, and its hard to keep 4 uninsured cars on the street without someone calling the city to get them towed. I miss my big driveway 

I only buy/sell G-body cars


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## Elle (Oct 25, 2010)

I'm going +1 Phoenix's recommendation about buying from an "official" dealership...we went through the Chrysler Dodge dealership in Mission, and I found that the service and knowledge level was WAY better than the usual Kingsway shyster dealerships. So if you have to work with a dealer, going through one that does used and new can often be better, although YMMV.

Better Business Bureau ratings are also really useful - always check them out if they are available.


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

Agree. My Kingsway "dealership" changed names (may be same owners? who knows?) a couple years after I bought my used 4-Runner. However, I had been looking for about a year for an 89 V6 convertible 4Runner and this was by far the best one. 

The only issue I really had with the dealership was that they told me it was a BC vehicle but afterwards, my friend at ICBC checked and found it was never insured in BC, so it was an out-of-province vehicle. Fortunately I didn't have a big rust issue with it. But I did have BCAA check it and they said it was a good truck. I was also working on an ocean fish farm at the time doing my thesis research and when they balked at doing some of the replacements that BCAA said was necessary and they had agreed to in writing, I just told them my friend who was standing in front of them would take back my deposit (as per the contract). They did the required work (had my mechanic friend double check it when I went to pick up my 4Runner and it ran like a champ till it got stolen in 2002.

My "new" CRV has been awesome and the most reliable vehicle. Its was bought new in 2002.


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## sunshine_1965 (Aug 16, 2011)

Make sure no matter where you buy a vehicle from that you do a background check on it for claims and liens. If there is a lien on the vehicle and you do not know about it it could cost you $$$$. Car could be repossessed or if in an accident and written off the lien gets paid before you do. As for price any price is negotiable. Do not be afraid to really offer a much lower price. Example an asking price of $5800 could mean they need $4100. Most people ask a higher price so that they can get what they really want for the vehicle. If I wanted $2500 for my car I would ask at least $3500 to allow negotiating to happen. Good luck in your search.

PS. I always offer half the asking price when buying a used vehicle and am never afraid of walking away. I always show them that I am serious with cash in hand. Like they say money talks and BS walks. $100 bills really show seriousness in my opinion.


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

So what kind of car you are thinking of getting Ming?

As the others have said I would definitely do the mechanic check and also an ICBC check on the vehicle. The BCAA service is decent enough for that purpose. If you have your own mechanic, even better and they can put it up on the hoist and have a real good look. 

Buying a car is a lot of fun. Or at least I found it to be fun!  I used to take a good close look at the wheels and front chin spoiler (if car is low) and bumpers...if they are banged up its a good indicator of how much care the owner put into the car. General cleanliness of the interior (look under the seats) and the engine bay are also good indicators. Pull the dipsticks and check the fluid for colour and for levels. I also look for the cleanliness of the door jambs and other areas of the body. All simple non technical things anyone can do.


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## clintgv (May 6, 2010)

I never have bought a used car in the dealership like the one in king george. Firstly, they sell for alot more. But the good thing is, some of the dealership actually fixes the cars if any problems and some DO NOT. I've always bought cars from private sellers (craigslist) much cheaper and plus they could sign it off as a gift for no taxes at both parties. In dealership even if its a used car you still have to pay taxes which isnt cheap these days hehe. You just have to know what your doing ie) engine stuff, checking if engine leaks, checking the fluids. And they tell you any problems or they can be sued i think? And basically you have to know if its aircared or not ofcourse. If it's not its gonna be something wrong under the hood which is COSTLY. haha. 

But when I bought my honda prelude that I had to recently sell due to going back to school and having a U PASS (free for all transit), it was fully loaded just like what i wanted in a car. Clean inside and out, Lowered, chrome rims, body kits, nice engine, 2 12" speakers covered by fiber glass hooked up to an amp. It was up for 3500 i believe on craigslist and got it for $2500. ITS a 1992 honda prelude but with a NEW engine so the mileage when i got it was aroung 80,000. 

Just my experience ^^


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## clintgv (May 6, 2010)

oh yeah check with the ICBC also. You could ask them if the car is rebuilt or not. if its rebuilt, anything higher then $1500 i wouldn't buy it. Anything over $2000 will mean it had repairs on the body frame which is going to be bad for the long term. If it's under $1500 it can mean like dents, scratches and non major accidents. Well that's what my mechanic friend told me


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## Foxtail (Mar 14, 2012)

I have bought new and used both privately and from a dealer... Unless you are paying cash ie. Payment in full, no loan. Used is the way to go. But if you are taking a loan for say a newer $20,000 car it would make sense to just buy new... Reason being the interest rate on new will be anywhere from 0% up to around 5% whereas used your interest rate will be minimum 6%, your payments will be almost the same. so yes as soon as you drive a new car off the lot you lose up to $10,000 of value but it can be worth it. Plus with new you get the full warrenty... And be careful about buying those extended warrenties on used cars... Most of the time the deductible is $500 and not worth using for a $500 repair.

"I stopped believing for a while... Journey is gonna be psst!"


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

Yes, I had BCAA 90 point check, ICBC check, Lien check, and my mechanic checked it. Can anybody say OCD? but really, these are all things you should do if you're looking to get a used vehicle. 

BTW, I had a friend who didn't get everything checked out and it turned out he bought a stolen VW for over $8000 and lost everything when the police came to take it away.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

This is not revscene, but since I respect some of the opinions of members on this forum, I'd like to hear of other members' experience buying a used car.

Have you ever purchased a used car? 
Yes, twice. And plenty of used motorcycles.
Did you buy from a dealership or one of those Kingsway/King George "dealership"?
I bought from a dealership where I knew the only once and am still driving this car. The other one was a Mazda that I bought from a reputable dealer which turned out to be garbage. 
Did you buy from a private seller or dealership? 
I've bought bikes from private and cars from dealers. 
Were you able to talk down the price of the advertised price of the used car? and by how much?  
Yes, but as much as 20% or as little as 5%. 
Did you have a positive or negative experience? 
Both 
Any mechanical issues with your vehicle soon after your purchased the used car? 
Yep, in the case of the Mazda, no in the case of the Toyota.
If you had to do it all over again, would you buy used or spend that extra money and buy a new car?
For a daily driver, used, for a garage queen, new.
Would you buy a car with more than 100,000km?
No problem at all if there are maintenance records .


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## keitarosan (Apr 21, 2010)

I'm selling my spare car right now and I'm a private seller....


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## ThePhoenix (Jul 23, 2012)

^great sales pitch


-ThePhoenix


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Lots to read and catch up with. 
So....what's your preference, domestic or imports?

I've always been fixated with the ideology that imports, japanese, have been better quality cars, but this past ten years have shown that American cars, primarily Ford, have matched te quality of Honda and Toyota.

Any thoughts? I'm currently driving an import but have recently contemplating making the switch to domestic brand. 

I think overall, it really depends on the driver's driving habit...pedal to the metal will certainly wear out the engine and tranny earlier than a gentle acceleration what it's suppose to be 

Sent from my Samsung Mobile using Tapatalk


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

I am now a firm Honda guy. I am not nearly as impressed with the overall long-term quality or user-friendliness of Toyotas.

However, some of the newer domestic SUVs (smaller ones) have impressive fuel economies and I would have to do a lot of reviews to see if it would be worth a switch in the future to domestic. Quality has gone up but the question for me is long-term reliability. My CRV is over 10 years old and still awesome. [knock on wood, knock on wood - Stay away Murphy]


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## Vman (Jan 20, 2011)

If you are buying a new car the. Go in early January. Dealers get new models and need to get rid off old ones. I went to Honda and got my Element from $26000 down to $18000. It was in the showroom and was last years model.


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## Lamplighter (Aug 3, 2012)

SeaHorse_Fanatic said:


> Yes, I had BCAA 90 point check, ICBC check, Lien check, and my mechanic checked it. Can anybody say OCD? but really, these are all things you should do if you're looking to get a used vehicle.
> 
> BTW, I had a friend who didn't get everything checked out and it turned out he bought a stolen VW for over $8000 and lost everything when the police came to take it away.


 A lien check is super important and can end up being the best investment made. I came closer than close in buying a stolen car. Another time the guy lied and told me that it was free from encumbrances but it wasn't.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> I think overall, it really depends on the driver's driving habit...pedal to the metal will certainly wear out the engine and tranny earlier than a gentle acceleration what it's suppose to be


You've seen that I'm a pedal to the metal guy sometimes. A warm engine to ease engine stress, regular maintenance, and safety checks make a big difference. I'd much rather buy a well taken care of sports car than a little old little who drives to the grocery store and back only 3 km a day but parks outdoors and does oil changes every 16000 km. Neglect is a much tougher nut to crack than hard driving. I actually try to stay away from ultra low mileage vehicles unless I know the owner, for that reason.


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## Alkatraz (Jul 20, 2012)

Who knew this thread would blow up on here, some great insights.

One more thing to add, if your looking at Jdm imported vehicles and have questions i would be happy to help. I Imported vehicles from Japan for 4 years.  

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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Some great feedback and valuable information. I've done tons of research and talked to a few dealership ex- salespeople i know of.



tony1928 said:


> So what kind of car you are thinking of getting Ming?...
> 
> Buying a car is a lot of fun.


Shopping for a car is a lot of fun especially when the ball is on side of the court and i have no rush whatsoever at the moment to rush into a purchase. Thinking of domestic.

I know from personal experience, buying a new car that is last year's model is a great deal, when you save 20% off msrp. I'll post a good article i read online about the ins and outs of the dealership.

Been awhile having a nice long good discussion like this thread.



SeaHorse_Fanatic said:


> I am now a firm Honda guy. I am not nearly as impressed with the overall long-term quality or user-friendliness of Toyotas.
> 
> However, some of the newer domestic SUVs (smaller ones) have impressive fuel economies and I would have to do a lot of reviews to see if it would be worth a switch in the future to domestic. Quality has gone up but the question for me is long-term reliability. My CRV is over 10 years old and still awesome. [knock on wood, knock on wood - Stay away Murphy]


I was a big Honda fan, but the last 5 year's Honda/Acura models haven't really interest me. Really liked the pre-2006 models, the newer models' interior looks 'cheap' compared to the older models. It's just me since I'm a traditionalist who likes a simple console and less fancy computerized system in a car. Funny how you mentioned newer domestic compact SUV's. They all look alike, CRV, Rav4, 2013 Ford escape.

Fish talk and car talk....what more can you ask for 

Sent from my Samsung Mobile using Tapatalk


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## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

ford same as honda and toyota? 

id say get a honda or toyota. it ll last you forever.. and its good on gas. 
and they are so common that you could find parts/ and mechanics that could easily work on it at a lower cost.


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## BCAquaria (Apr 24, 2010)

I used to always buy new. But after realizing the depreciation it just didn't seem worth it. Just make sure to do research on the car you plan to buy. It's always better to spend a little more on a better condition car.

Don't ever truly believe everything the salesperson/owner says. You kind of need to do your own check ups.

I usually check forums or autos.ca for used car reviews and lookup the common problems. Cars that often seem like a "steal" often have their issues.


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## andresont (Apr 24, 2010)

30 point Check list for used car buying. - Canreef Aquatics Bulletin Board
I am not a mechanic, but developed some skills and made a list. very easy to check a used car by your self.
see link above. I go by different name there on Canreef, (they kicked me out for being against the war, so i re-registered under diff name) 
At any rate to make long story short personally i could not care less about the mileage. The wost thing to happen to a vehicle is overheat not driving, then all the seals an gaskets becoming brittle, crack and engine starts to leak oils all over. So first thing to do is to check engine sides and the bottom if it is relatively dry its ok to proceed further. Some times the will be oil from the spills around the engine oil fill cap, this could be an indicator of the frequent oil adding which means leaks or excessive oil consumption. I never buy a vehicle for more then $10k. I honestly think buying new is waste of $.

What is a $1000 when you buy a new car? Nothing, but a $1000 is a lot! when you fixing a car (providing you don't go to dealer)

I have had over 20 cars in my time and my present car has over 300K and it drives, feels and delivers like new!
I would never buy from dealer. The reasons are simple: 
-They are in a business to make money not friends,
-They sell what they have on the lot, and that is what they "_*recommend*_"
-Dealer _*may be not telling the truth*_ , because they don't know and make things up, they have few stories that they tell every customer that comes in.
-The inspection they give you means nothing, if car drives they will try to sell it. They will only fix things when YOU find them.
-Powertrain warranty means very little. they will only fix a problem if you can Not drive a car. ie if the car is still drivable they will not fix the problem. 
I will buy from Craigslist or from privet seller because:
-privet seller may not be as good in lying as sells people and you can easily tell.
-they only have one car to sell at the time and most likely it will be less then from the dealer, usually at least $2500 less.
-I will buy from Craigslist because it is a lot easier to negotiate when you find a problem.


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## shady280 (Oct 17, 2011)

ill chime in here from my standpoint of being a proffesional mechanic of 15 years. if you can afford new and really want it then go for it, new cars are great and have a warranty and some even include maintenance. if you dont want to get hit by depreciation then buy a 1 or 2 year old that still has some warranty but buyer be ware for anything used. even a year old car with low miles can be mal-maintained. some people forget about oil changes and go 40,000!! ive seen it all too often. as far as import vs. domestic its prefference and thats up to you. a word of advice, while domestics have some things wear faster or more often it costs less to repair whereas when imports break its harder to fix parts arent there on the shelf all the time and the part is 2-3 times more costly. that said as well new domestics have almost caught up to imports with quality and performance after they almost went bankrupt!! there are some imports that have more issues than even a ford, did you know hondas transmissions are garbage for a large period of time after they moved the plant to america? or they burn and use oil frequently? if the car is used bottom line is take a mechanic or bcaa with you, and as posted above get a compression check done, only way to look inside and gives you a great idea how its doing. so what would i buy as a mechanic? right now i drive a 95 altima, my future plans are a newer f-150 for the wife and ive been tinkering with the idea of either a mitsubishi lancer awd turbo or a kia forte koupe and i think they come in turbo. i commute and want something fun and reliable and the ability to modify it at some point, i just cant leave cars alone it seems. i also own a 79 datsun 280zx modded to race status but still street able but thats another story. hope that helps


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## sunshine_1965 (Aug 16, 2011)

clintgv said:


> oh yeah check with the ICBC also. You could ask them if the car is rebuilt or not. if its rebuilt, anything higher then $1500 i wouldn't buy it. Anything over $2000 will mean it had repairs on the body frame which is going to be bad for the long term. If it's under $1500 it can mean like dents, scratches and non major accidents. Well that's what my mechanic friend told me


$2000 damage to some cars are very minor. I had someone hit my car and just tear the bumper just enough to have to replace it and it was more than $2000 for parts paint and labor to fix it. The report from ICBC will tell you the type of claim on vehicle if any. I think this report costs like $20 or so. I would also never buy a car unless it is registered in BC. Out of province cars require an inspection before they can be registered here. This could be very costly to do.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

sunshine_1965 said:


> $2000 damage to some cars are very minor.


Absolutely true. One HID headlight on a BMW is $1500 plus labour, so $2000 damage is almost meaningless nowadays, when most cars are in the $30k range.


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## andresont (Apr 24, 2010)

30 point Check list for used car buying.

I am not a car mechanic but gained this knowledge by experience. All you need is OBDII reader that you will plug in to the car OBD plug (practice on your own car) to check for codes and faults, and a regular voltmeter.
Any one can do it, I know a woman who did understand almost all from the list below, she was able to do it by practicing on her own car.
I am sure i missed something but this is good for start. Also keep in mind there is no car that is perfect even a new car will have some imperfections.
.
Check list for used car buying.

1. Plug in OBDII code reader. It should say: no DTC codes present and no faults stored. 0/0 zero codes stored in the memory. If monitors are not ready (flashing circles) that means there was "Check Engine" warning "On" and it was just reset, also OBD code reader will tell you if there is anything sitting in the car computer (O2 sensors swapped for example). If you find anything that means obviously that you don't have to waste your time there. If car computer tells you that all is OK, please proceed to a simple 30 point inspection described below.

2. Car needs to be cold (not driven for at least 1.5 hrs). Open radiator cap, (for this to work cooling liquid level should be close to the top, ask owner to top off) and start the car, there should be no bubbles coming out from radiator. Car must be cold or not driven for at least 1.5-2 hours. If bubbles are coming out that means head gasket is compromised. If antifreeze shoots up in the air it means head gasket is blown, the higher it shoots up the worse is the head gasket problem. If no bubbles no "fountain/gazer" head gasket is OK. The idea behind this is that IF there is a crack in a head gasket then cooling liquid will slowly (that's why car needs to sit for at least an hour or two) leak in to the engine block. When you start the car with radiator cap open, combustion gases will quickly force liquid out from the engine block back in to cooling system and you will see a small fountain or a bibble.

3. When you ask owner to start the car, have a second person check for smoke at the tail pipe immediately after start., while you checking the radiator fill pipe as per #2 above.

4. Lift the oil dipstick while car is running should be no smoke coming from the dipstick pipe. This indicates that piston oil rings are OK.

5. Engine must be dry all over no leaks; wet engine means it was previously overheated.

6. Check all fluid levels.

7. Check for radiator leaks (boil over) at the expansion tank.

8. Check for noises after initial start up, at low and high rpm.

9. Check radiator cooling fan operation by leaving engine running. Fan will turn "ON"&"OFF" at about 90C.
10. Cars with "hydraulic fan clutch" lightly pull one of the fan blades by hand to see if there is any play.

11. Check radiator hoses integrity at clamping points.

12. Check A/C operation by turning "ON" at low setting (about 18C) and checking condenser piping. If it will produce light frost on the pipe (Summer Time) or gets a lot colder then the environment that means AC is working properly.
13. Check heater for leaks by setting heater lever to "Hot" that means interior heating coil is open 100% to coolant flow and leave it like that fully open. If there is a leak you will see drops of coolant liquid on the floor carpet usually close to gas pedal from central console. Or in some cases on the passenger side of the central console but same from the heater vents and on the carpet.

14. Check battery voltage while engine is running on idle should be 13.9-14.5VDC, this will indicate that alternator is working properly (must be above 13.5 VDC)

15. Check for gasoline smell and engine oil burning smell at the engine compartment.

16. Check under Engine sides and the Engine should be all dry no oils drops, transmission needs to be dry as well.

17. Check exhaust flex pipes and Cat Converter cases while some one accelerates. Should be no excessive play (movement)no noise, no exhaust leaks.

18. Check CV boots all must be flexible and dry, no cracks.

19. Check CV joints (when driving) by slowly turning in circles with steering hard to the right and then hard to the left. Should be quiet. If knocking/crackling noise is present that means CV joint is bad usually ($220 per side to repair)

20. While under the car check for brake hoses, ball joints, steering for all rubber boots integrity.

21. Check undercarriage integrity (especially for trucks) should be no cracks and frame should have no cracks, no welds.

22. Check shocks/struts should be dry. If wet, needs replacing. Push hard on the front and release quickly if car bounces more then one time (1.5), that means shocks are gone. Bounce once (only upward after you release) shocks are good.

23. Check all lights: Head lights, Fog lights, taillights back up lights, turning signals and hazard lights. All should be firm sitting in place and when touched should be no movement. When any rear or head light or bumper, or other exterior parts are moving or loose, that means there was a hit.

24. Check bumpers same as above should be sitting very firm on the body and all gaps should be the same.

25. Windshield vipers

26. Windshield washer pump.

27. Fog lights

28. Check voltage when all lights are on, and all music equipment (especially Sub woofers if applicable) the voltage Should be still above 13.2 VDC. That will indicate that alternator can take the load and all wiring is done right.

29. Check all power windows, power door locks, power mirrors, sun roof .
30. Check all the gaps between panels (hood & fenders, rear door &sides, side doors and body) should be all equal gaps. If gaps are different that means it was damaged previously. If all gaps are the same that means all OK.
*
Test Drive*:
Check Automatic transmission shifting. Has to be smooth (no noise no impacts, no jolting), by selecting lowest gear and the manually switching to higher gear. After that stop and drive slowly increasing speed to say 60Km/hr, let it shift automatically until transmission will shift to the top gear all should be smooth.

1.Check Low gear selector 2-high-4-High 2-Low 4-Low (if applicable)
2. Check interior heater (see #12 above), radio, instrument cluster, warning lights ( with ignition off).

*If you do take to the mechanic or any reputable repair shop* most and foremost insist on two things (you can do all visuals yourself or a friend can do it for you as per above list):
*1*- *Engine compression check*. This will tell you if the car engine is healthy (oil consumption (burning), cylinder/piston rings condition, spark plugs age (as they have to be removed to do the test). This is the only way to "look" inside the engine and be sure.
*2*-Ignition check with the *oscilloscope* aka the Scope. Also a very easy & quick test which will tell you about camshaft position sensor as well as ignition coils. If Cam shaft sensor or its wiring is not good ECU (computer) will not get the right reference in terms of when to ignite and this will cause misfiring. This leads to increased fuel consumption and bad performance. It happens when people are replacing all spark plugs, all spark plug wires and ignition coils just to find out that a $50 camshaft sensor is not good.

If this can help even one person i am very happy.

Obviously if you don't want to drive an old car and if you OK financially go ahead and buy a new one nothing wrong there except environmental impact of course (new car production pollution, old car scrapping pollution, scrapping and production of the new batteries, oil and other fluids, Hybrids are even worse(but this is whole new discussion))
But even if i had the money i would not buy a year or two old car, i would rather buy a new one then. Because like some one mentioned before, sometimes people abuse new cars more then old ones. I would be checking a year or two old car more vigorously the the used one for that reason. Don't assume that someone will be as diligent and as careful as you with the new car or a truck. And also remember that it is so easy to damage even a new car, when you neglect basic rules (liquid levels, no overheating causing excessive idling, on time filter changers oil and air).

Also being on topic of cars (My apologies to the Ladies !) i have to say this: *Lady Driven*? stay away from it! I have seen so many cars and The Most Neglected ones were the "Lady Driven" ones. Yes the rear view mirror most likely will be clean as well as interior. but mechanical part i have never seen one lady driven car that was Not overheated, did not have oil seepage or leaks, CV boots not torn, and had all fluids with proper levels.

I know how my own wife drives! even though she knows a lot about cars. May be there *is* a Lady which is Not like that but i haven't met one yet.

Perhaps the reason is that some people are not aware of what is the meaning of proper car care and it is not their fault of course. Who knows that sitting on the parking lot and idling for 30 minutes would *potentially* cause overheating and more damage then high speed HWY driving? (lower oil pressure when idling, especially on "breathing" engines when rpm goes below 500 or up and down, less or no air flow around the engine bay, potential low cooling liquid level, old or wrongly mixed cooling liquid, cooling fan might not kick in due to dirty electrical connectors, or due to worn hydraulic cooling fan clutch the air flow is insufficient)
How many people will let the car to cool down for 45 seconds after up hill or heavy, afternoon city traffic driving; before stopping the engine hot? (this concerns especially smaller then 3.0L or less engines, if you have 5.0L or larger V8 don't worry about *idling overheating*, it won't.)

thx for reading and sorry about the rant. I LOVE Ladies!!!


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## Captured Moments (Apr 22, 2010)

I have had my fair share of used cars and even trucks over the years, been there and done that. Some were good cars, others not so much. You can have the vehicle inspected by a mechanic or what have you but you can never be sure of what potential lurking problems lies ahead. Components can fail quickly without being detected at the time of inspection. 
The degree of concern and apprehension towards buying a used car is in direct proportion to the price you pay..I suppose. 
Finally this year, I decided to for once get a brand new car, one with the new scent of leather, one that has never been used by anyone. one for my family, one for reliability. Have a treat once in a while.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

andresont said:


> 30 point Check list for used car buying.
> 
> I am not a car mechanic but gained this knowledge by experience. All you need is OBDII reader that you will plug in to the car OBD plug (practice on your own car) to check for codes and faults, and a regular voltmeter.


That is a good idea. But the scammers all know how to reset the codes. And if you're dealing with an honest person this probably isn't needed. So it's a bit of a catch 22. Plenty of people reset their codes before AirCare and that's why the whole system is pointless, but that's probably something we don't want to get into here.


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## BCAquaria (Apr 24, 2010)

2wheelsx2 said:


> Absolutely true. One HID headlight on a BMW is $1500 plus labour, so $2000 damage is almost meaningless nowadays, when most cars are in the $30k range.


Yup. Someone smacked into my old BMW, damage wasnt that bad. Bumper lightly damaged, HID headlight cracked, airbag did not deploy. Still costed ICBC 7k to repair.

OEM parts are sometimes just super overpriced.


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

BCAquaria said:


> I used to always buy new. But after realizing the depreciation it just didn't seem worth it. Just make sure to do research on the car you plan to buy. It's always better to spend a little more on a better condition car.
> 
> Don't ever truly believe everything the salesperson/owner says. You kind of need to do your own check ups.
> 
> I usually check forums or autos.ca for used car reviews and lookup the common problems. Cars that often seem like a "steal" often have their issues.


I was always in the mindset on buying new but sometimes it makes financial sense to buy a 1 or 2 year old car with low km and save $6k. That money you save could be the money saved towards potential repairs...which is still worth it.

Some really great input and I just want to thank everyone who has added their 2¢.

I think that BCAA inspections and carfax are the norm at big dealerships. I'm not even going to consider any kingsway/king george dealerships. They're a lot of ICBC rebuilts in those 3rd tier markets


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## mcrocker (May 29, 2010)

I have a slightly different strategy when it comes to buying used cars, I buy the dirt cheap ones and drive them into the ground. It's not for everybody, but it has worked well for me. Not long ago I had two cars written off within one year, both of them with other driver being at fault.(people turning left through traffic) Instead of being a stressful ordeal where I lost 'my baby', I turned a profit on both cars without even needing to negotiate with ICBC, and moved on to another cheap car. If you buy a car at a price that's less than it's typical blue book value, you are sitting on potential profit if it gets written off. I don't know how ICBC decides on their opening offer, but in both cases it seemed fairly reasonable for the vehicle, and was not based on the purchase price.

My reasoning for this strategy is that even a newer car (say 5-10 years old) doesn't come with any guarantees. Like a previous poster mentioned, mileage is only one factor, people can wreck cars in a short amount of time by abusing them or allowing them to overheat. If you buy from a dealer they may give you a 3 month or 1 year warranty, but even that is not very much compared with how long most people hope to own these cars. Newer cars have become less reliable than older cars IMO, you may run into something like an electronics issue that is very expensive to repair and can't easily be done yourself. Brand new cars may come with a real guarantee, but you pay a huge premium for them.

For me the 'sweet spot' is in the sub-$1000 range. It's not hard to find an reliable economy car in this price range, and if anything major goes wrong you can walk away. Granted I do most of my own repairs, which has an impact on the cost. I have not been stranded by one of my vehicles for many years, and last time was when I was still willing to spend 2-3K on a car. I got a used Honda Civic h/b with low mileage (for a Honda, ~160K) and the engine blew within a few months. I still think Hondas are great, I just got unlucky. This did make me much less willing to spend significant money on an older car though.

I do also have a motorbike though, for when I have urges to polish something, go fast, or look good on the road...


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

mcrocker,

Your strategy works for someone who is single (or mostly drives by themself), can do most repairs and is not too worried about being stranded if the old beater breaks down. Unfortunately, most of us don't fall in these categories. My wife would refuse to let me drive around my kids in an old beater I picked up for less than a month's rent.


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

To align the discussion back on track, let's take it as i'm looking for a used car that is between the price of $9000 to $20,000. 
Let's not get into the old beater talk . Want to avoid deviating discussions that lead to semantic debates.


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## andresont (Apr 24, 2010)

2wheelsx2 said:


> That is a good idea. But the scammers all know how to reset the codes. And if you're dealing with an honest person this probably isn't needed. So it's a bit of a catch 22. Plenty of people reset their codes before AirCare and that's why the whole system is pointless, but that's probably something we don't want to get into here.


Let me correct you *with all due respect* on both points.
1- If the codes were reset OBD scanner will flash engine monitors indicators, and will give yellow light instead of green, which means codes were reset and engine have not yet had a chance to go through all driving sequences, so No, you can not hide problems by resetting the codes because it will be obvious when OBD scanner is plugged in. 
2- The air care technician will not let the vehicle to go through the testing procedure for the above stated reason. They will tell you to come back when all monitors are ready. Some AirCare techs will let you go through testing with one monitor (out of many) not ready, but the rest of the monitors must be ready and there should be no registered codes. The re may be pending codes but if you have more then one vehicle will most likely fail the test.

try to reset the codes next time you go through Air care and see if you can get it pass the test.

However i agree with you that AirCare program is pointless though.


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Let's not get into these debacles on who's right or wrong - no one is right and no one is wrong. Just give your experiences and that's all i ask for. Thank you for respecting my simple request for this thread. 

Sent from my Samsung Mobile using Tapatalk


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## Foxtail (Mar 14, 2012)

Ok give us your criteria... What year range and style? Suv, pickup, wagon, sedan, coupe, bycicle? Lol 4 wheel drive or 2 wheel drive? Horsepower or economy? Fully loaded or base model? 

"I stopped believing for a while... Journey is gonna be psst!"


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Read the original post. I only asked for your experiences buying a used car NOT "help me find a used car".

Mods please close this thread, there's some great info and experiences provided. Thread will just turn into a revscene debate of trolls. Thanks M's.

Sent from my Samsung Mobile using Tapatalk


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## andresont (Apr 24, 2010)

jobber604 said:


> To align the discussion back on track, let's take it as i'm looking for a used car that is between the price of $9000 to $20,000.
> Let's not get into the old beater talk . Want to avoid deviating discussions that lead to semantic debates.


Good point.
So here is good guide line that most people go by when buying a car
1- Reliability
2- What do i need the car for (SUV, family sedan or small get to work city car)
3-Obviously price
4- color, likes dislikes in terms of shape features etc.

So in terms of reliability some people prefer to get a Non interference engine
A piece of mind knowing that even if you go beyond 120+K when timing belt fails the valves and pistons will not meet, all you have to do is to get the car to the shop your engine is still in one piece. Versus interference when above mentioned parts do meet you don't have the engine anymore!

You are asking about a car with 100K or more so the first thing to ask the owner is the timing belt, was it changed? 100-120K Is the manufacturer recommended period for T-belt change (Though new high end Conti T-belts are rated for 100K miles =160K). If yes, does the owner have a receipt? Without receipt i would consider T-belt Not changed. Usually water pump, rollers and tensioners as well as the rest of the belts are being done at the same time, however on highly reliable cars (Lexus for example) this is not always required at the point of 1st T-belt change, because water pump may not leak and will work for a long time and can be done with next T-belt change. 
You can check if the vehicle of your choice has interference engine here on gates web site. it will show in red in right column.

Here is an example of the interference engine: click on link above and enter Passenger cars & Light trucks,1999 Audi A6 V6 2.8L.The right column will show in red and say interference engine.

Someone was right about Japanese cars being less reliable then in the past. Honda and Acura had terrible record on Transmission reliability when they moved production lines to USA. Many Honda's and Acura's had very bad tranny problems except Acura RL (still made in Japan) So if you decide on import get one that is still made in a country of origin. for example Don't get a VW Jetta foe example, its made in Mexico get a VW Passat Turbo Diesel made in Germany.

Nissan Maxima were great cars very reliable and easy to fix. Well not anymore, last good Maxima was made in 1999. The 2000 Maxima was nothing but problems, next generation was in 2004 and it gotten from bad to worse unfortunately.

My todays choice in your price range would be
1-Lexus GS (Sedan) some are All Whell drive. 2007 Lexus GS 350 AWD
2-Lexus RX (SUV). LEXUS RX 330 2005
3-Infiniti QX4 2001 to 2003 with 3.5L engine (it has timing chain and legendary reliability) but will eat 2 liters /100km more gas. This one is a last true 4x4 truck, after that they have hydraulic viscosity transfer case just like Honda CRV and they overheat when go off road for more then 15-20 min of engaged AWD . 2002 QX4 . 2001 Infiniti QX4 Only 125xxxkm
4-Infinity G35 or G35X (X=all wheel drive). Fun to drive sport car. INFINITI G35 2005 - 136,000 KMS - Great CONDITION ! . G35x Infiniti 2006 Low KM
5- Toyota Rav4 small SUV looks good with the hood scoop, black is not my fav color though. 2005 Toyota RAV4 PLUS*86K Km*
6- Mazda Protege5,protege5 is very reliable and can even withstand a Lady Driver ! (my wife drives one) and Mazda3 both made in Japan also very reliable cars with non interference engines.
7- Toyota Camry, Not made in Japan anymore and *very boring car with out any character* that is why i put it on the last place on this list. But because they made gazillion of them most of the bugs are worked out and it is very reliable car shares the same non interference engine with RAV4 ( 2.4L engine.)


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

Closed as per OP's request. If OP wants to reopen, please pm me or one of the other mods.

Anthony


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