# Ken's Fish Food



## alpha7

Hi - this may have been asked before but does anyone in the Vancouver area sell Ken's Fish Food or does one have to order direct from him?

Thanks!


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## 2wheelsx2

Charles has brought some in before, but I'm not sure if he has any now. I've gotten earthworm sticks, soft and moist, and 5 stick blend from him.


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## alpha7

*Thanks!*

Thanks - I'll check with Charles. Thanks also to those who PM'd me


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## ncutler

I'm also looking into setting up a group order. But it was pointed out that there may be restrictions now in importing fish food. One could be fined if that were the case.

i did notice John's Fish Food is a Canadian equivalent, though prices appear to be higher too. I'm looking at getting conditionning food mostly like the golden pearls.

Does anyone else have experience with this kind of food?


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## CanadaPleco

Johns Fish Foods are from Kens fish, so that is why the price increase. I've tried nearly all of Kens foods and they are a regular part of my fishes diet. earthworm stick, shrimp stick, spirluna stick, super brine flake, earthworm flake, tropical flake, golden pearls of various sizes... never had a food from him I have not liked.


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## ncutler

Have you had any issues importing? I noticed there was an stricter importation rule that came into effect April 2009. Have you imported since then?

Any recommendations of food to help conditioning/breeding? African Tang Cichlids primarily. Golden Pearls, but also thinking about decapsulated brine shrimp, brine shrimp flake, growth crumble.

Another question: does anything need to be refrigerated? Is there any statement of expiry dates on the food? May not order as much if you answer "yes" to either of the above 

I've emailed him to see if he's aware of any issues. I'd rather not be fined if there's any changes.


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## traco

I've gotten Ken's flake food from Mykiss. My fish love it ... no expiration for the flakes that I could see. Got spirulina, color booster and premium flakes.


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## CanadaPleco

Zero problems bringing in any of kens fish foods. and there is no expiry date on any of the foods I have ordered at least. They come vacuum sealed.


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## ncutler

Thanks! While the food's are cheap, it's sure easy to get a lot!


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## 2wheelsx2

ncutler said:


> Thanks! While the food's are cheap, it's sure easy to get a lot!


That's how it starts. I have over 10 lbs of fish food.


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## ncutler

Just a note: I emailled Ken. He said there's a 1 year shelf life from the date of purchase, but it can be extended by freezing it.


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## cypho

*ken*

i just order 15lbs of food and there was no problem bringing over from the U.S.


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## Victor

I'm looking to get 10 pounds of floating cichlid food. Anyone try it before?


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## anessa

We've ordered a LARGE amount of Ken's food and we saved a huge amount getting it shipped to The Letter Carrier in Point Roberts and picking it up. The custom's officer didn't even charge us for taxes although even if we had to pay duty, we still would save a TON from buying fish food locally.


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## Victor

i'm thinking about just shipping it directly to Vancouver. I think shipping for 10 pounds of food is about 33 bux which is still decent


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## Victor

Has anyone bought anything from them recently, i'm just hearing things from here and there about troubles getting the stuff across the border

Also, am i suppose to use US Priority mail for shipping? 

Thanks


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## RD.

This topic keeps coming up in various discussions, so hopefully the following post will clear up any confusion as to what the current laws are regarding importing fish food into Canada.

The Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) recently updated its policy (AHPD-DSAE-IE-2001-9-7) for Animal Health Import Requirements for Pet Food. The policy provides information and direction to Canadian importers and foreign exporters of pet foods, supplements, treats and chews on the import requirements, eligibility and conditions of these products entering Canada.

Generally speaking, commercially prepared pet food and pet treats containing non-bovinae ingredients from the United States will require an Import Permit as issued by CFIA, only after the successful completion of a risk assessment questionnaire. In addition an Importer Statement of Compliance and Canada Customs Invoice or a commercial invoice which must link to the shipment and clearly describe the product(s) being imported, indicating the country of origin and end use.

Pet food and pet treats which contain bovinae ingredients from the United States also require the Import Permit and Customs Invoice information as above but also require a Zoosanitary Export Certificate and an Original export Health Certificate, endorsed by a full-time, salaried veterinarian of the USDA Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS). It is important that importers of these products are fully aware of the specific requirements as contained within this Policy to avoid any possible delays or refusals at the border.

The step by step process for non-bovinae pet food products can be found here:
http://www.cscb.ca/listinfo/Import_non_bovinae_PF_USA.pdf

And for those which contain bovinae ingredients (such as blood meal, bone meal, etc)
http://www.cscb.ca/listinfo/Import_bovinae_PF_USA.pdf

A direct link to this info posted on the CFIA website;
Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Import of Pet Food, Treats and Chews Containing Animal Products and By-Products

Each & every product/brand requires a separate permit, one permit does not allow you to import numerous brands of pet food. Each & every permit requires a facility questionnaire to be filled out & signed by the actual *manufacturer*. Ingredients, processing methods & temperatures, etc are required.

Vendors such as Ken, John at Jehmco, or some guy on Aquabid are not *manufacturers*, and cannot provide these documents themselves, even if a Canadian wanted to jump through the hoops linked to above to apply for a permit. These documents would need to come directly from the actual manufacturers of each make/brand of fish food.

Each & every shipment must have the proper paperwork & CFIA permit attached, or you pay your $$$$ and you take your chances. Yes, some shipments might slip through the cracks, so the question becomes how lucky are you feeling today? The bottom line is that sans a CFIA permit, it's now illegal to import fish food in any quantity.

The following is a direct quote from one of the head CFIA agents in Ottawa.



> "No pet food whatsoever will be allowed into Canada without the proper paperwork & permit. Not even a single container or bag for personal use. Anything that is caught at the border will be confiscated & destroyed."


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## tony1928

I think its one of those things where as the other poster said, its up to you to take your own chances. Officially, we're probably not supposed to bring any over. Practically though, I've never ever even been asked at the border about pet foods. I'm sure every other car coming back from the states has some kind of dog food / cat food or other in their car. I'm guessing that the CFIA is more interested in commercial large scale importation rather than the individual bringing back a few bags of food for personal use. I've bought from Ken and also ordered many of the commercially available foods and brought it over from the states. In fact, many times, that's the only thing I've brought back and declared it as such. CBSA has never even paused before waving me through. Just my personal experience.


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## RD.

The exemptions for personal use are also in place, and the CFIA is just as concerned about importation for personal use, as they are commercial importers. As previously stated: The following is a direct quote from one of the head CFIA agents in Ottawa.

*"No pet food whatsoever will be allowed into Canada without the proper paperwork & permit. Not even a single container or bag for personal use. Anything that is caught at the border will be confiscated & destroyed." *

These regulations are still fairly new, and many CBSA agents are 
still not up to snuff with all of the changes, and human nature being what it is, some are probably too lazy to be bothered.

Having said that, I've already heard from a few people that have had their shipments (containing fish food) rejected at the Canadian border by CBSA agents, so as previously stated if you want to play the smuggling game you pay your $$$ & you take your chances. It's not a matter of IF one gets caught, but a matter of when.

If you read the links above it should be crystal clear that importing almost any form of pet food into Canada sans a CFIA import permit is now illegal. 
Personal use included. While it may seem odd to consumers to consider pet food illegal contraband, without an import license, and a valid CFIA permit in hand, that's exactly what it is.

Even dog & cat food for personal use while travelling across the border is now regulated.

From the CFIA link above:

16. Pet food - traveller's exemption
The provisions of subsections 6.5(1) and (2) of the Health of Animals Regulations apply to persons entering Canada and wishing to import pet food for personal use:

6.5(1) Except in accordance with a permit issued under section 160, no person shall feed to any animal material in any form - whether or not incorporated into another thing - that is derived form specified risk material.

(2) Subsection(1) does not apply to a person who feeds a pet food, pet chew or pet treat to an animal if:

a.the country of origin of that product is the U.S.;
b.the person on entry into Canada from the U.S., was in possession of the product and was accompanied by the animal to which it is fed;
c.the person legally imported both the product and the animal into Canada; and
d.the product is fed only to the animal that accompanied the person into Canada.
In addition to the provisions stipulated in the Regulations, the pet food must be commercially prepared processed pet food, either wet or dry. It must be in its original unopened bag or can, and the label must clearly indicate the list of ingredients. A maximum of 20 kg per entry is allowed.

Countries other than the U.S.

•Pet food containing animal ingredients: Not permitted - entry prohibited.

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## RD.

BTW - I might as well toss this out as well. For those of you that enjoy cross border shopping, come Dec. 10th 2011 certain fish, molluscs, and crustaceans will also require a permit from the CFIA when entering Canada.

Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Importation of Aquatic Animals Into Canada

Some of you may already be aware of these changes, but for those that aren't just a heads up.


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## seanyuki

Great info Neil.....just curious how much for those permits? and how many days to get it.

http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/for/pdf/c5083perimpe.pdf



RD. said:


> BTW - I might as well toss this out as well. For those of you that enjoy cross border shopping, come Dec. 10th 2011 certain fish, molluscs, and crustaceans will also require a permit from the CFIA when entering Canada.
> 
> Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Importation of Aquatic Animals Into Canada
> 
> Some of you may already be aware of these changes, but for those that aren't just a heads up.


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## RD.

The cost of a permit varies depending on whether it is a 1 time deal, or for 1 year, and most likely whether the food is designated non-bovinae, or bovinae ingredients. They can take several weeks to obtain, and from what I've heard even several months. A lot of it depends on who you are dealing with at the CFIA but regardless they need to go through a local CFIA office, then off to Ottawa for approval, which also includes being rubber stamped by a CFIA vet. I would think a best case scenario would be a min of 10-14 days. The food being exported then needs to have your permit attached, and a CFIA Statement of Compliance attached from (you) the importer, which requires a trucking or shipment PRO #, etc, along with your permit # and signature. 

The real catch is this, part of the approval process requires paperwork to be filled out by the actual manufacturer of the product, not some online vendor who has simply private labelled someones elses food. A facility questionairre must be submitted by the actual manufacturer of the food, and not many are willing to do this unless you are a licensed commercial importer/distributor. The CFIA requires ingredients, processing temps, etc-etc and most of the larger manufacturers are only going to supply this info to parties that they have a trusting business relationship with. 

If one is simply looking to import trout chow in bulk from a US based feed mill chances are there won't be any problems getting the manufacturer to assist you, as long as the order is worth their effort. 

HTH


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## AfricanCichlids

RD. said:


> This topic keeps coming up in various discussions, so hopefully the following post will clear up any confusion as to what the current laws are regarding importing fish food into Canada.
> 
> The Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) recently updated its policy (AHPD-DSAE-IE-2001-9-7) for Animal Health Import Requirements for Pet Food. The policy provides information and direction to Canadian importers and foreign exporters of pet foods, supplements, treats and chews on the import requirements, eligibility and conditions of these products entering Canada.
> 
> Generally speaking, commercially prepared pet food and pet treats containing non-bovinae ingredients from the United States will require an Import Permit as issued by CFIA, only after the successful completion of a risk assessment questionnaire. In addition an Importer Statement of Compliance and Canada Customs Invoice or a commercial invoice which must link to the shipment and clearly describe the product(s) being imported, indicating the country of origin and end use.
> 
> Pet food and pet treats which contain bovinae ingredients from the United States also require the Import Permit and Customs Invoice information as above but also require a Zoosanitary Export Certificate and an Original export Health Certificate, endorsed by a full-time, salaried veterinarian of the USDA Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS). It is important that importers of these products are fully aware of the specific requirements as contained within this Policy to avoid any possible delays or refusals at the border.
> 
> The step by step process for non-bovinae pet food products can be found here:
> http://www.cscb.ca/listinfo/Import_non_bovinae_PF_USA.pdf
> 
> And for those which contain bovinae ingredients (such as blood meal, bone meal, etc)
> http://www.cscb.ca/listinfo/Import_bovinae_PF_USA.pdf
> 
> A direct link to this info posted on the CFIA website;
> Canadian Food Inspection Agency - Import of Pet Food, Treats and Chews Containing Animal Products and By-Products
> 
> Each & every product/brand requires a separate permit, one permit does not allow you to import numerous brands of pet food. Each & every permit requires a facility questionnaire to be filled out & signed by the actual *manufacturer*. Ingredients, processing methods & temperatures, etc are required.
> 
> Vendors such as Ken, John at Jehmco, or some guy on Aquabid are not *manufacturers*, and cannot provide these documents themselves, even if a Canadian wanted to jump through the hoops linked to above to apply for a permit. These documents would need to come directly from the actual manufacturers of each make/brand of fish food.
> 
> Each & every shipment must have the proper paperwork & CFIA permit attached, or you pay your $$$$ and you take your chances. Yes, some shipments might slip through the cracks, so the question becomes how lucky are you feeling today? The bottom line is that sans a CFIA permit, it's now illegal to import fish food in any quantity.
> 
> The following is a direct quote from one of the head CFIA agents in Ottawa.


bla bla bla....

I imported 50 LBS no problem 2 days ago.

and offer it to all my fish freinds who prefer it to OTHER brands super high cost.


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## RD.

I can't help those who lack in reading comprehension skills. 

If you prefer to run your business (if it is indeed a business?) by illegally importing products into Canada that really isn't my concern, and if you would like to post your name & number here I'd be happy to have someone from the CFIA contact you to explain in more detail what I previously posted. 

You might want to think twice before encouraging others to break the law, as you are doing, and openly admitting it on a public forum. Not too swift amigo. 

Some hobbyists will get caught, and some hobbyists will lose their order at the border. It's a simple reality, and is already starting to happen. 

BTW - I import fish food by the transport truck full, and have been for several years. 

bla-bla-bla indeed.


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## luckyfind

So Neil if you buy NLS by the truckload what is the cheapest place in Western Canada to buy a 5lb pail and at what price would that be?


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## BaoBeiZhu

yeah RD. do you have a list of what you have ?


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