# Low KH / High GH / High PH ?



## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

Hi there,

I have a heavily planted 32G shrimp tank running for 6 months now - no CO2, no Ferts, low/medium LED lights.

The PH sits at 7.5, GH around 140ppm and KH under 20ppm, 0 Amonia/Nitrate/Nitrite.
I have 2 bags of ADA amazonia, a lot of Seiryu stones, Ebiken Shou, Ebiken Kou-yang (Calcium Bentonite), + 2 rosewood stumps from King Eds.

I have added a bunch of almond leaves hoping to lower the PH: no effect at all, PH sits at 7.5.
I have no idea why the KH is low, while GH and PH are sort of high.

The shrimps are doing great (CRS/CBS, Blue Pearls, Green Babaultis, PFRs), 
but Id like to get the PH around 6.5 and KH a bit higher for stability.

Any ideas / advices on what would be the cause of my water parameters and how to rectify it ?

Thanks in advance!

Nicolas


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## snailies3 (Mar 29, 2013)

Hm. I have high KH/ low GH/ high PH 
I think I just need to get equilibrium, correct me if I'm wrong, but I add baking soda to my tank to raise the KH. However, it also raises the ph. 
I have two tanks of assorted snails, with heater, aerator, thermometer.


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## effox (Apr 21, 2010)

Youmakemesohappy: What's your PH out of the tap? What is it if you let it gas off over night?

I've never experienced that high of a PH with ADA soil, I've had 3 different batches of amazonia II. When I added the almond leaves it dropped it down a measurable amount on top of that. I actually increased the KH\PH a little with some crushed coral to bring it to around 6.7ph with a KH of 4, if I recall correctly.

Are you sure your KH test kit is right? Or is your low KH attributing to the rising PH?


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## effox (Apr 21, 2010)

Do me a favour and PM 2wheelsx2. His name is Gary and he is a geologist, and certainly knows his aquarium stuff to boot. Ask him to view this thread. It'll benefit others who search and stumble upon this as well.

I looked through a bunch of forums and found one post that claims that Seiryu stones can increase PH. The other information I found said it's unlikely it would be measurable though, so Gary should be able to give an intelligent response where I failed.


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## crimper (Oct 20, 2010)

effox said:


> Youmakemesohappy: What's your PH out of the tap? What is it if you let it gas off over night?
> 
> I've never experienced that high of a PH with ADA soil, I've had 3 different batches of amazonia II. When I added the almond leaves it dropped it down a measurable amount on top of that. I actually increased the KH\PH a little with some crushed coral to bring it to around 6.7ph with a KH of 4, if I recall correctly.
> 
> Are you sure your KH test kit is right? Or is your low KH attributing to the rising PH?


+1 on this. Ive been buffering my 90G planted just to boost my ph as it drops to 5.2 most of the time.


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks for the answers! My tap water PH is around 7.2/7.5.

When I do water changes (once every 2 weeks) I use tap water with Prime + Stability + mineral conditioner sometimes (when GH is too low)
The water sits in a bucket for 30 minutes then goes in the tank, should I just have a water change barrel for water to sit in for a while?

I have low KH in my 2 tanks, I fixed one by adding some crushed coral so maybe Ill do the same for the shrimp tank, 
but since the PH already sits ay 7.5 I'm worried that adding crushed coral is going to raise PH even more and kill the shrimps.

I will PM 2wheelsx2 and ask for his opinion, thanks again!


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## effox (Apr 21, 2010)

I don't age water when using Prime. I just match temperatures and apply the respective dosage of Prime directly to the tank.

Our tap water has very low levels of KH\GH. I'd leave the KH until you get you gradually lower your PH personally. It's gotta be the rocks doing it, as your soil\driftwood\leaves should all add acids that would lower the ph to at least a mid 6 I would expect.

With that said, if your shrimp are breeding prolifically, or aren't dying off and you're happy with where you're at, don't play with the PH too much. The KH being low is a concern though, so I'd try removing SOME of the stones, and I'd add some crushed coral to the filter, personally.

Let's see if Gary can provide insight.


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks Effox,

I have sent a pm to Gary.
The shrimps are doing great, most of them are breeding fine except for the CRS.

I don't intend on playing with PH other than trying to lower it very slowly over time.
I thought about the crushed coral but this will raise PH as well and its already pretty high,
so ideally Id like to get the PH to lower first.


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## crimper (Oct 20, 2010)

Youmakemesohappy said:


> Thanks for the answers! My tap water PH is around 7.2/7.5.
> 
> When I do water changes (once every 2 weeks) I use tap water with Prime + Stability + mineral conditioner sometimes (when GH is too low)
> The water sits in a bucket for 30 minutes then goes in the tank, should I just have a water change barrel for water to sit in for a while?
> ...


7.2/7.5 from your tap?? This is the first time I've heared getting ph higher than 6.8 here at the Lower Mainland... esp. Vancouver. I used to live in Vancouver and the ph there is normally 6.8.

What test kit are you using?


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

API test kit, Ive checked about a dozen times too!
I'm nearby the PNE, maybe it varies depending on the area?


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Youmakemesohappy said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I have a heavily planted 32G shrimp tank running for 6 months now - no CO2, no Ferts, low/medium LED lights.
> 
> ...


Sorry guys I threw out my back last week and have been busy with work so haven't been on BCA much lately. Thanks of the PM Nicholas.

The answer is your Ebi-Ken Kou-Yang, which is Ca Bentonite. Bentonite is from volcanic ash which when dissolved raises pH. But it supplies the necessary calcium to your shrimp. You can also try Ebi-Ken Sosei which will lower your pH. The ADA should buffer your water to low 6's in the pH range, but it appears the amount of Kou-Yang you are using is offseting that. Another way to lower pH of course is to inject CO2 at a low rate. But in reality, if your shrimp are doing well, and breeding, I wouldn't do anything about it. However, Frank is the shrimp expert so I would wait to hear what he says for what you should do. I can only answer about your water chemistry. The KH is not too relevant if your GH is stable and in a good range (and yours is - at 140 ppm).


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Youmakemesohappy said:


> API test kit, Ive checked about a dozen times too!
> I'm nearby the PNE, maybe it varies depending on the area?


It varies a bit based on your proximity to the treatment points. I believe soda ash is added to prevent corrosion of the plumbing, which will raise pH a bit.


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks for the reply Gary! 

Ideally I'd like to bring the PH slowly to under 7 - I might try to add more almond leaves first,
then maybe I will remove parts of the calcium bentonite and see if that makes a difference.

Thanks again guys for all the advices!!!


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

I'm not using much calcium bentonite though, under the recommended amount for my size tank.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Youmakemesohappy said:


> I'm not using much calcium bentonite though, under the recommended amount for my size tank.


It doesn't matter how much you use as long as the water is able to dissolve it. Whether you use 3 grains or 10 lbs the water can only dissolve what it is able to dissolve, related to how much the plants/invertebrates uptake.


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

OK, I had no idea it worked like that, thanks!

Well, I guess I'll wait and see, shrimps seem to be doing fine, so maybe I won't do anything unless PH keeps rising...


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## effox (Apr 21, 2010)

As I mentioned and Gary confirmed, if the shrimp and living life large and breeding happily, don't change it. The PH can crash though due to low KH from my understanding of the situation and that'd be my only concern.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

You can always add crushed coral or crushed oyster shells to your filter to buffer the KH/pH a bit. Without CO2 injection it won't raise your pH much. But realistically if your ADA AS is fresh (ie, you didn't buy it used) there's plenty of buffering capacity it for a year or more.


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## Youmakemesohappy (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks Effox and Gary,

I have to clean the filter tomorrow, maybe I'll throw in a tablespoon of crushed coral.
The tank is 32G so that shouldn't be a huge change, and at least it will rise KH a tiny bit.


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