# totally confused and shocked



## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

So as some of you may know, I had/have an ick issue in my tank and I was getting ready to setup an quarantine.

In the tank I originally had
2 small clownfish
2 larger clownfish
A yellowtail similar damsel
A flame angelfish
a six line wrasse
A snail and a hermit crab

At first I lost my two smaller clownfish. I found the one dead and the other is yet to be found although I have come to terms with the fact that he is dead.

then the already sick when I got him angelfish died.

a couple of days ago the damsel started hiding all day but was alive (at least yesterday night it was)

Today I woke up to find BOTH the larger clownfish dead NEXT to each other! Out of nowhere. Never had any spots on them, never hid, always played around, ate etc.

I have no ammonia or nitrites and I have 10-20 nitrates.

I don't understand what happened. I am really shocked especially by the death of the clownfish.

Any ideas/help and advice?


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## aQ.LED (Nov 13, 2012)

how long you had those clown fish?It is not unheard of that the pair will die together, I had few exp when one of the pair about to die the other will hang around the dying/dead mate until he/she die as well. Most of the time due to stress. either because they are newly introduced or they have been bully by something else or sickness. If you don't see any ick on them then they could be dying cuz of stress. How big is ur tank btw? It seems that u got two pair of clown fish in a single tank. Also when you said u got ick, did u treated ur tank with anything?


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## onefishtwofish (Apr 21, 2010)

i dont know s/w but i do know that in order to rid a tank of ich the whole tank needs to be treated. also what caused it? new fish? if not then it may be stress related. im sure some salties will chime in.


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

So the tank is new, 2-3 weeks but it was set up with items ffrom an established tank. Live rock, live sand, water, fish etc. I supplemented with bacteria and everything went well as I am 0 at ammonia and nitrites.

The tank is 75 gallons. I tried treating with kordons natural which works great in freshwater but I didn't have enough time before everyone started dying. I was ready to quarantine but again didn't manage to.

I never noticed any bullying. The tank had/has ick but I never saw it on them.

Btw gravity is 1.023 and pH is 8.0


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

Freshwater ick has nothing in common with saltwater ick. Unfortunately. I have treated freshwater ich many times, easily and effectively but this ******* is a PITA.


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## scott tang (Jan 29, 2012)

I shut down my big sw cause of this couldn't treat sw ich well with out copper 


I still have my bio set up when they get ich they seem to over come it


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

Yeah but doesn't copper destroy everything else? Invert. And live rock?


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## onefishtwofish (Apr 21, 2010)

try a uv sterilizer i guess


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

For marine ick? It doesn't work.


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## Hollyhawk (Mar 28, 2011)

I have no advise but I would like to say how bad I feel for you.


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## aQ.LED (Nov 13, 2012)

You didn't answer me if u see the two large clown fish has the ick. However, here is what I will suggest you do without the copper treatment to your main tank. 
Move your fish to a large enough QT, leave any invert in your current main tank. Make sure the QT (can be even just a rubber container) has a powerhead and a heater or a air pump will do. You can then treat that with proper medicine. 
In your main tank, do not add any new fish in it. Slowly increase the temp in it to about 80F and keep it up like that fishless for 1 month. That should help you remove the ick in the tank by eliminated the host and break the life cycle. Increase temp will increase the life cycle of the parasite. When it doesn't have a host to feed on, it will die off by itself.


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

1. I did answer to that and said that they had no spots

2. Marine ick is not affected by temperature changes like freshwater ick.

3. Quarantine and empty tank should happen for at least 2 months and not only 1 month


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## aQ.LED (Nov 13, 2012)

Monk21 said:


> 1. I did answer to that and said that they had no spots
> 
> 2. Marine ick is not affected by temperature changes like freshwater ick.
> 
> 3. Quarantine and empty tank should happen for at least 2 months and not only 1 month


I guess you are well covered then. Good luck with the rest of your journey. Sorry to see the loss of fish, however, I probly think that the fish die to stress and changing envirmnet.but again, it could totally none related.


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

aQ.LED said:


> I guess you are well covered then. Good luck with the rest of your journey.


I didn't mean to insult you. I am just sharing my part of knowledge so we have a better conversation


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## aQ.LED (Nov 13, 2012)

Monk21 said:


> I didn't mean to insult you. I am just sharing my part of knowledge so we have a better conversation


don't get me wrong, wasn't thinking it was a insult, cuz i really can't add any more advice that it is, simply the fact that when I got ich, I remove all fish out treat the QT and that is all I do, by saying a month simply cuz lots ppl don't have the patience to wait longer, I actually keep my fish in QT for up to 6 months before put them back to my MT. Espcially when u said u got 75g, not many people got a large QT tank can fit all the live stock in there for over a month


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## scott tang (Jan 29, 2012)

studies show it is affected by temperature

its also affected my salinity


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

A link to that study...? 

You are probably referring to freshwater ick but ok.

Salinity does kill it if too low but it also kills everything else except for fish


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## scott tang (Jan 29, 2012)

if I come across it again il post it for you 
I am not referring to fw 
my reef consists of montipora lps softies and non photo synthetic as well ass snails hermits tinny britle stars bristle worms the works 
I have done low salinity in this tank and It worked no ich and so actually you can do it with out killing any thing

im sory that you are losing fish I have been thru that its auful my advice is do what aq led said and set up a qt bucket or tub


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

Hyposalinity is considered when your gravity reaches 1.009 or lower. If u reached that low u killed something if u reached like 1.018 then it didn't even affect your ich


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## scott tang (Jan 29, 2012)

you seem to be talking about research I im talking personal experience 

I also am not going to argue with you my salt was at 1.015 corals seemed fine some softies and monties bleached but brought em back and were fine
edit o yea it killed ick to


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## Hollyhawk (Mar 28, 2011)

There's nothing like personal experience


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## Animal-Chin (Jul 10, 2012)

I'm guessing you have started a mini cycle as yoru tank is so new. Marnine fish are super sensitive and not only has their environment changed but there has been ich in the tank too. You used that natural ich cure and that adds something, even if natural, to the water. My guess is the fish are all getting stressed but all these sudden changes and this could be what's killing them off. I'd do a bunch of big water changes over a couple of weeks and then let the tank settle. Don't add anything at all. If you don't see ich spots on any of the fish after a couple of months you should be ok to add. I know this sucks cause we get our new tanks and we want to play but unfortunatly you have to take it slow now. If you start to re stock you're fish will get ich no doubt. Healthy fish can just fight it off but it's a gamble with each fish you add now. If you plan on going reef or if you have coral and inverts I would add any treatments to the tank even if they say reef safe...


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## aQ.LED (Nov 13, 2012)

Animal-Chin said:


> I'm guessing you have started a mini cycle as yoru tank is so new. Marnine fish are super sensitive and not only has their environment changed but there has been ich in the tank too. You used that natural ich cure and that adds something, even if natural, to the water. My guess is the fish are all getting stressed but all these sudden changes and this could be what's killing them off. I'd do a bunch of big water changes over a couple of weeks and then let the tank settle. Don't add anything at all. If you don't see ich spots on any of the fish after a couple of months you should be ok to add. I know this sucks cause we get our new tanks and we want to play but unfortunatly you have to take it slow now. If you start to re stock you're fish will get ich no doubt. Healthy fish can just fight it off but it's a gamble with each fish you add now. If you plan on going reef or if you have coral and inverts I would add any treatments to the tank even if they say reef safe...


I think he meant "wouldn't" for his last sentense =P but yes agree with that. Stress probly kill more fish than anything else. Even Ich should relate to that as well as if fish are healthy enough, they usually pretty good repelling ich.


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

If the mortalities pile up fast, it is probably Marine Velvet, NOT ick. Looks similar but much deadlier. Sorry to hear about your losses. Had a bout or two with Marine velvet years ago and it was truly devastating. 

Only a copper treatment early on will stop MV. Copper is also the "best" treatment for Ick but needs to be in a tank that will never house inverts like corals or snails in the future.

Anthony


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

Yeah MV was what wiped out my last foray into SW. Killed all my fish in under one week. Truly devastating.


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## Animal-Chin (Jul 10, 2012)

ya I meant wouldn't.


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## JTang (Apr 21, 2010)

Wow that's sad! Sorry for the loss. I don't have much to suggest since I have never had such bad experience in my short 2 yrs of reef keeping. My Regal did get ick couple of times in the past but he fought it off himself. All I did is bigger, more frequent WC's plus lot of Selcon, Amino Acid, Vitamin C soaked mysis. 

Here's is an article that might help...

Marine Ich/Cryptocaryon irritans - A Discussion of this Parasite and the Treatment Options Available, Part I by Steven Pro - Reefkeeping.com


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## scott tang (Jan 29, 2012)

i got velvet in my 125 first time i stocked it got ich the second time wiped most of it out put some more stuff in and got ich again so i shut it down lol


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

Wth is going on? There goes the damsel too. I don't know if it is relevant but eyes were popped out and it turned white and started rotting only 4 or 5 hours after death.

I feel ****


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## scott tang (Jan 29, 2012)

you have velvet -_-


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## Monk21 (Feb 3, 2013)

I know I can search for it on my own but do u suggest a specific site to read about it?


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