# The Great Canister Debate



## MPerkins (Aug 25, 2010)

I've kept fishtanks for years, but have never had a canister filter. I would like to get one but am having trouble deciding on a brand. I have a 29G tank that will ultimately have cichlids in it. I would like to get a canister soon and cycle my tank with something small and cheap (like tetras) before I get my cichlids. I haven't decide yet what kind of cichlids to get, but am currently leaning to dwarfs such as Rams.

I would appreciate anybody's input on Eheim vs Fluval as well as information on how long i need to have one set up before stocking my tank, and how long to cycle with tetras before switching to cichlids. If you use another brand of canister feel free to offer input on that as well. I'm not married to any brands atm.

Thanks
M


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

xp vs fluval vs xp is all opinion based. all three can exceed expectations, or disappoint.

personally i choose xp due to the biggest bang for your buck


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## Mferko (Jun 8, 2010)

i like my eheim never had any probs, that being said i think the filter media inside has just as much of an effect perhaps more than the brand of cannister.
eheims biosubstrat is awesome, for a 29G it shouldnt be too expensive either.
dont cheap out and get potscrubbers if you need lots of biofiltration such as with cichlids in my opinion.


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

I bought an eheim ecco for my 33 and it comes will all bio media. Nice setup and quiet.


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## gklaw (May 31, 2010)

Agree, eheim are nice and quite. Still don't understad why their parts are so flimpsy and so expensive. Has a 2232, replaced a $6 clip right the way the hose connector broke - $20 retail. The whole new filter only worth $100. If their rubber suction cup ever agae, you are looking at $2 a piece.

Very good filter but I am not sure if I will go for it based on the replacement parts cost. XP may be a bit nosier but more robust. Followed by Fluval.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

potscrubbers work great for those who dont overstock their tanks to hell, they offer more surface area than most sponge products without clogging as easily. but his question is on the filter, not the media. the media you speak of works in the other two filter brands aswell


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## jkam (Apr 21, 2010)

Personally I love Rena XP series. Easiest to use and good price for what you get. I also have Eheim's but I dont like them for the price. I don't see that much benefit to them and I'm just waiting for the day my 2028 and 2026 leak. Eheim's are just nicer looking XP's in my opinion. 

HOWEVER, get eheim media. I find it to be the easiest to clean and its much more porous than Rena's or Fluval's. 

While I'm on the topic of fluval's, I hate them (except FX5 but it still has some issues). Fluvals are flimsy, difficult to prime and have a terrible design to their media baskets. Rena and Eheim are superior to Fluval in almost every way except price.


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## Mferko (Jun 8, 2010)

jkam said:


> HOWEVER, get eheim media. I find it to be the easiest to clean and its much more porous than Rena's or Fluval's.


+1
my cannister is almost completely full of that stuff with a coarse blue sponge at the bottom below it all and a packet of purigen on the top with a thin layer of filter floss
works great and the flow takes several months to slow down noticably


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## pdoutaz (May 13, 2010)

I just switched from an XP4 and 2 AC 110's to a Fluval FX5 (about 2 months now) and so far really like the FX5. Running on a heavily planted and likely overstocked 120G
Just my 2¢ worth


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Buy a used one, so you're not paying full pop, and try it out for yourself to find out. Or ask a favour of another member and see for yourself what the different features and noise levels are.

As for how long to set up before you can put fish it: as soon as the water is dechlorinated and the temp is in the correct range, assuming you're going to cycle it with tetras. But I would advise against that. Instead, why not use a fishless cycle with ammonia, or if you have other tanks, take some media/substrate/plants from the other tanks and put it in your new one and you're immediately ready to go.


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## donjuan_corn (May 6, 2010)

27 gallon, xp2 imo, but any time I had only a 27 gallon tank I had a HOB like the AC50 I believe or ac 70.


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## Rayne (Jul 12, 2010)

I'd recommend the Eheim classic line. XP and Fluval may be good but they cant touch the 20+ year reliability record of the Eheim classics. The classics don't have any of the newer bells and whistles of the Eheim Pro line like priming.. but that just means there are also few pieces to break. They are energy efficient, dead quiet and damn near indestructible!


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## jkam (Apr 21, 2010)

pdoutaz said:


> I just switched from an XP4 and 2 AC 110's to a Fluval FX5 (about 2 months now) and so far really like the FX5. Running on a heavily planted and likely overstocked 120G
> Just my 2¢ worth


The only thing I don't like about the FX5 is how much water comes out when you disconnect the hoses.


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## hp10BII (Apr 23, 2010)

Rayne said:


> I'd recommend the Eheim classic line. XP and Fluval may be good but they cant touch the 20+ year reliability record of the Eheim classics. The classics don't have any of the newer bells and whistles of the Eheim Pro line like priming.. but that just means there are also few pieces to break. They are energy efficient, dead quiet and damn near indestructible!


+1

I've had a number of Eheims over the years, Pro II's , Ecco's, my favourite by far are the classics. Stealthly silent, parts are easier to get compared to the Pro II's, cheaper too.

A few small tetras probably wouldn't contribute much to the bioload necessary for a tank for cichlids unless you're prepared to watch your new setup carefully fora mini cycle. As 2wheelsx2 mentioned, fishless cycling with ammonia can handle a full load right away or aged media from another tank.


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## Mferko (Jun 8, 2010)

hp10BII said:


> +1
> 
> I've had a number of Eheims over the years, Pro II's , Ecco's, my favourite by far are the classics. Stealthly silent, parts are easier to get compared to the Pro II's, cheaper too.
> 
> A few small tetras probably wouldn't contribute much to the bioload necessary for a tank for cichlids unless you're prepared to watch your new setup carefully fora mini cycle. As 2wheelsx2 mentioned, fishless cycling with ammonia can handle a full load right away or aged media from another tank.


how do you determine how much ammonia your fish will be putting out?

i think i might use this technique when i get my new 150 but im not clear on figuring out how much ammonia to start it off with and where to get the ammonia


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## hp10BII (Apr 23, 2010)

Mferko said:


> how do you determine how much ammonia your fish will be putting out?
> 
> i think i might use this technique when i get my new 150 but im not clear on figuring out how much ammonia to start it off with and where to get the ammonia


You can't determine how much ammonia your fish will be putting out unless you want to sacrifice a few fish in an uncycled tank and start measuring ammonia levels. 

Lots of articles online for fishless cycling. IIRC, Most recommend starting with ammonia levels between 3 to 5 ppm. That's way more than what a reasonably stocked fish tank can produce, so the nitrifying bacteria in a fishless cycled tank will adjust downwards to the level of nitrogen the tank inhabitants produce when you've introduced your fish.

The ammount of ammonia to use depends on the concentration, quality and maybe shelf life of the ammonia. My jug is going on 6 years, it needs more to bring concentration levels up. I bought my litre jug at Save On Foods. Plain household ammonia, - not sudsy, no surfacants. I've seen some at Superstore and I think London Drugs too. Shake it up, there should be no bubbles/suds. Should cost about a little over $2.

Start out with a small amount - you can always add more later. Test ammonia levels about an hour later and add more if needed to bring to 3-5ppm ammonia. Too much past 5ppm could delay the fishless cycle. Write down the amount used, so you can just top off what's needed to maintain the nitrifying bacteria before your fish arrives.


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## Acipenser (Apr 21, 2010)

I doubt you need a canister for a 29 gallon cichlid tank. I ran a 125G cichlid tank for years with just 2 AC110's. There is a great thread on MFK about filtration, specificaly bio. I think if you really want a canister you wont go wrong with the xp line, The stackability of the media wins for me . I would still run a small hob just as a back up and to run carbon ect. its a pain in the ass pulling apart a canister to change carbon.


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## DR1V3N (Apr 22, 2010)

Acipenser said:


> I doubt you need a canister for a 29 gallon cichlid tank. I ran a 125G cichlid tank for years with just 2 AC110's.


True. For a 29 Gallon may I suggest a Rena XP 1 or just plainly known as Rena XP.

Filstar XP Canister Filter

Like others said, it's the best bang for your buck. I've found it's one of the most user-friendly when you consider: priming, cleaning and maintenance. All important when choosing your first canister filter.

It's rated for use in up to 45 Gallon tanks if you're the type of person that sees the benefits in over-filtration.

You can change over to whatever media when it comes time to replace.

I think Pamela is selling 2 at $50.00 each used if they haven't already been taken.


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