# Bad information! Buyer beware.



## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

First off I have to say that I love the selection of fish in king eds, in my opinion the variety is unparalleled in BC.

But I really, really hate the guy who runs the freshwater section. He doesn't care about customer relations, all he cares about is the sale of fish.

I went in the other day to pick up a fish for a friend, and every time I go into the store I get a new story to tell people about how awful this guy is.

I have many first hand stories about this guy, my last one got deleted so I'm going to try to keep this informational. If this must be edited to keep the warning to other aquarists, please do so without changing the warning, or tell me and I will gladly do so.

I went in to buy a Niger cat, great fish, very healthy, good price. I saw that there were some gars for sale but they didn't have the name on the tank so I asked him. He said they were alligator gars. I'm looking for a Florida gar as they don't grow as big and told him this. What he told me was that the alligator gar wouldn't outgrow my 225 gallon tank... Umm... really? Wrong! Then he proceded to tell me that Florida gars get bigger than alligator gars... Umm... Seriously?!... Wrong again! 

What he told me couldn't be further from the truth, in fact it's a complete lie. 

For anybody who reads this I strongly suggest doing research into the fish before you buy from this guy because he doesn't care if you can't take care of it for its life, he only wants to get the money from the sale.

Moderators, please don't delete this post. While king eds do have an amazing selection of fish, at decent prices for the most part, and I do like to go see every once in a while, I am only trying to warn people who aren't better informed. 

Be cautious, and do your research before you buy anything from this store.


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## AKAmikeross (Nov 5, 2012)

Nothing new... sounds like 99% of all the shops I have been to. Nice thing is king ed's is 99% better then most of those other shops in terms of price and african cichlid selections. Their staff, especially the family owners are good people... with that said I know exactly who you are talking about lol.

I personally haven't had any issues with kind ed's but like you said, I do my research before I buy, I go in there knowing exactly what I want to buy.


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## AdobeOtoCat (Dec 10, 2011)

Ya. They're not the best LFS. But their staff sure as heck beats pet smart or pets habitat.

Your frustration is something all of us had experience with. But making money in this business is hard, and which is why we see all sorts of tactics - good and bad. 

Sent from my SGH-I727R using Tapatalk 2


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Do the people at petsmart, or pet habitat yell at you in front of other customers because "you are asking too many questions!" or "I don't want maybe! Yes or no! Right now!". The worst thing for a customer is to be yelled at, especially in view of other customers, for no good reason.

Keep in mind moderators these are my own personal experiences to which I can expand on immensely, but I'm not for fear of this thread being deleted.

Stores like petsmart and pet habitat have the bread and butter fish, they never get in specialties, and as such have a very limited knowledge of fish keeping. However the people there, even though they don't have much experience or knowledge at all, are very nice to talk to. 

As with any potential fish purchase you should do your own research prior to buying, however, included in the research is asking people who know. The guy at king eds knows quite well how to lie to people in order to get them to buy what he's selling. All I'm saying is don't listen to anything he says, do your own research, because most of what he says is a bold faced lie in order to get a sale.

King eds brings in some amazing variety and rarities, which is why I still go there.

However, I do have many friends who have also had some amazingly bad experiences there, some dwarf mine in severity. I'm not going to publicly post these as they didn't happen to me, but if you're interested I can either direct you to the people who have had these horrible purchases or can simply PM you the stories myself if you prefer.


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## kacairns (Apr 10, 2012)

You ever thought to maybe shop somewhere else since every time you go in there you have a bad experience? Might save yourself the time of typing these rants up and the frustration that leads to them


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## crimper (Oct 20, 2010)

Have you talk to Ron (the Owner) regarding this issue? I would suggest resolving the issue with the owner/management first before posting your frustrations here.

There's one instance that I had a not so good experience with one of the staff, Ron apologized to me and made things right.


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

While I somewhat agree Crimp, I have to believe Ron has gotten many complaints about that individual in particular and he's still there. The rest of the staff there is a super friendly bunch especially Ron & his wife....shame one person has to be so much different from the rest.
Personally I have gotten to the point of doing my research beforehand to avoid having to ask questions to find out later I got wrong answers. Especially after buying bog plants that I was told were not bog plants....from the same person. I highly recommend everyone does the same for their own sake for any place they shop at. As for that particular guy being referred to....he's always been that way and always will be might as well get used to it lol Educate yourself before going there, then all you have to do is tell him what you want, let him bag it and get the heck out.
Also IMHO most places that sell unique fish as such do not usually care what happens to the fish once it's sold. Them and one other place were selling Arapaima which can get up to 8'. Who the heck has a tank to house one of those when they mature? What happens to then when a person cant keep it or rehome it? Only one place I have been to actually asked about the tank I planned on keeping a certain fish in and that was IPU when Grant owned it. I can't ever remember any LFS asing me that question. 
In this day and age, I feel as the caregiver, a person should be responsible enough to do their own research given the many resources available through the Internet, before making a purchase of something your not familiar with.

PS: you will notice I removed this from King Eds section and put in the Aqua Lounge for lack of a fitting place. As a sponsor I believe he would prefer someone contact him with the complaint for a possible resolution... before posting it in the section they paid for. Afterall your complaint is about one employee, not the store as a whole.


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## charles (Apr 21, 2010)

I am pretty sure the store has florida gar. In a way, the mis-ID fish is not going to be bigger than "what he called an alligator gars". He just got both of them mix up 

It is kind of confusing...

What he called an alligator gar is actually most likely a florida gar which is true that what he has in his tank will not grow bigger than what he called a flordia gar...

On the flip side, if you want a niger cat, I have 2 here for $40 each.


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## josephl (Apr 21, 2010)

I used to go to the store weekly but haven't been for almost 2 years now for the (service and courtesy) reasons that the OP posted. I work hard for my $ and the cheapest price isn't always the most important thing. 

There are many people in this town who can bring in any fish that you want, it's just a matter of asking and waiting. Off the top of my head, I can think of Aquariums West, Fantasy Aquatics, Canadian Aquatics(both Patrick and Charles) and Canadian Aqua Farm that will always bring in cool stuff if asked. Other stores that always have odd balls are Fraser Aquarium, North American Pets and Mutliplex. All of these owners and staff are friendly and know their fish. 

Haven't missed King Ed at all since I stopped going


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## Dawna (Jul 29, 2013)

Master wilkins said:


> Do the people at petsmart, or pet habitat yell at you in front of other customers because "you are asking too many questions!" or "I don't want maybe! Yes or no! Right now!". The worst thing for a customer is to be yelled at, especially in view of other customers, for no good reason.
> 
> Keep in mind moderators these are my own personal experiences to which I can expand on immensely, but I'm not for fear of this thread being deleted.
> 
> ...


Lol I know what you mean by that person. Whenever I ask him something, hes partially correct. The rest I just nod it off. Honestly, I agree with you, if you are committed to buying something, its best to research them before seeking them. If you just rely on the few questions answered by the workers, there may be more things you don't know about than just those questions which can lead to problem after buying. But at least when I asked him where some fishes were imported he was correct.

Back when I was beginning the whole aquarium thing, I bought 3 albino cories from petsmart when it was on sale, and they didnt know where they were from. I saw a few that weren't as active but the worker insisted its because they were bottom feeders so its normal for them to just hang and drift a bit with the current. The worker had problems getting the more active cories so they got frustrated and just got the more "inactive" ones and said they are fine and are the same as the rest. Turns out the first one died after a day, the other 2 died few days later. I did a complete water test and nothing was wrong with the tank, my other fishes were ok. It turns out the cories weren't even healthy, I even let them do a water test on my water sample and it was fine. I ended up getting money back and bought some cories elsewhere and they are still alive in my tank 

I don't think the guy in kinged is purposely trying to mislead you so he can sell off the fishes, I just think he lacks the correct knowledge because hes mostly always just "partially" correct.


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## crimper (Oct 20, 2010)

Dawna said:


> I don't think the guy in kinged is purposely trying to mislead you so he can sell off the fishes, I just think he lacks the correct knowledge because hes mostly always just "partially" correct.


I disagree. I sent my friend there to get Aquaflora plants, not only he misled my friend by giving him with a bunch of junk plants claiming they were Aquaflora plants, my friend ended up with $180 worth of nuisance aquarium plants.

As I've said I talked to Ron and immediately apologized and made things right for my friend.


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## Dawna (Jul 29, 2013)

crimper said:


> I disagree. I sent my friend there to get Aquaflora plants, not only he misled my friend by giving him with a bunch of junk plants claiming they were Aquaflora plants, my friend ended up with $180 worth of nuisance aquarium plants.
> 
> As I've said I talked to Ron and immediately apologized and made things right for my friend.


Lol that shady guy


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## jhj0112 (Jul 30, 2013)

I have to agree with you ( master wilkins). This is THE reason I drive from Cloverdale to Richmond, Vancouver or d/t to buy fishes. 
To me, good customer service beats having rare fishes.. Not only these guys(richmond, Vancouver, d/t) have good healthy fishes but also their customer service is exellent especially to my kids! Without going into too much detail, this particular person wasn't the case.. At the same time, I should probably give kinged more chances as I heard/read other people who work there are great...


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

I have never been to King Ed, don't even know where it is. I usually get my staff from Pat and Charles, or other members here. I have never really gone too far from Richmond to buy any fish.
I probably will never go to King Ed after reading this. Cheap price is not everything.
A customer should not be required to do all his homework before he shops--it is good for the customer if he does his homework, but the point of having a service associate in a store is to provide customer service, which includes providing answers to questions a customer may have. If he does not know the answer, a "I am sorry I don't know, but let me find out for you." will work just fine with me.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Diztrbd1 said:


> While I somewhat agree Crimp, I have to believe Ron has gotten many complaints about that individual in particular and he's still there. The rest of the staff there is a super friendly bunch especially Ron & his wife....shame one person has to be so much different from the rest.
> Personally I have gotten to the point of doing my research beforehand to avoid having to ask questions to find out later I got wrong answers. Especially after buying bog plants that I was told were not bog plants....from the same person. I highly recommend everyone does the same for their own sake for any place they shop at. As for that particular guy being referred to....he's always been that way and always will be might as well get used to it lol Educate yourself before going there, then all you have to do is tell him what you want, let him bag it and get the heck out.
> Also IMHO most places that sell unique fish as such do not usually care what happens to the fish once it's sold. Them and one other place were selling Arapaima which can get up to 8'. Who the heck has a tank to house one of those when they mature? What happens to then when a person cant keep it or rehome it? Only one place I have been to actually asked about the tank I planned on keeping a certain fish in and that was IPU when Grant owned it. I can't ever remember any LFS asing me that question.
> In this day and age, I feel as the caregiver, a person should be responsible enough to do their own research given the many resources available through the Internet, before making a purchase of something your not familiar with.
> ...


Thank you, I completely agree with what you have said and appreciate you not deleting it but merely moving the thread to another place.

I personally do at least about a weeks research on a new fish before I commit to buying it for myself.

I have no quarrel with anybody in king eds besides the one person whom I am referring to, in fact the last time I was in (I don't know the name) gave me a deal on filter parts. I was, and still am, very appreciative.

My one and only motive for posting this thread is to make the buyer beware... Do your research, tell him what you want, and get the hell out of there.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Master wilkins said:


> Do your research, tell him what you want, and get the hell out of there.


What kind of shopping experience is it if I have to make a special effort to avoid talking to the person working in the store, and try to leave as fast as I could? I would rather not bother.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Fish rookie said:


> I have never been to King Ed, don't even know where it is. I usually get my staff from Pat and Charles, or other members here. I have never really gone too far from Richmond to buy any fish.
> I probably will never go to King Ed after reading this. Cheap price is not everything.
> A customer should not be required to do all his homework before he shops--it is good for the customer if he does his homework, but the point of having a service associate in a store is to provide customer service, which includes providing answers to questions a customer may have. If he does not know the answer, a "I am sorry I don't know, but let me find out for you." will work just fine with me.


On the subject of customer service you have it bang on! If you don't know, nobody is going to think less of you if you admit it. The opposite is true if you mislead on purpose.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

kacairns said:


> You ever thought to maybe shop somewhere else since every time you go in there you have a bad experience? Might save yourself the time of typing these rants up and the frustration that leads to them


For the longest time I haven't gone. I only went in to get something for a friend who lives on the island.

This isn't a frustrated rant, I am only trying to spread awareness that people need to be cautious in what they hear from this person.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Fish rookie said:


> What kind of shopping experience is it if I have to make a special effort to avoid talking to the person working in the store, and try to leave as fast as I could? I would rather not bother.


You haven't been there, they have an exceptional variety in both fresh and salt water species. It's just the one guy I'm warning people against who might not know better.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Yes, I have heard many great things about them being cheap and have a large variety to choose from. But for me personally cheap is not everything and I do not really get to keep that many fish at the same time anyway. I do not buy too many fish. 
I like Rick of Canadian Aquatic even though he is all the way out in maple ridge because I know I can always get the help and info I need when and if I need them, and the experience has always been very positive. Customer satisfaction is obviously the top priority for Rick. It is not just buying the fish I want at a great price but it is the great experience while in their home/store that makes me want to go back. 
If this person has received that much complain and according to others posted in this thread the owner knows about it yet he is still allowed to work there treating customer this way just makes me wonder customer satisfaction might not be the top priority of this store. But it is just my first impression from reading this thread. I have never been there so you are right I probably should not draw any conclusion.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

charles said:


> I am pretty sure the store has florida gar. In a way, the mis-ID fish is not going to be bigger than "what he called an alligator gars". He just got both of them mix up
> 
> It is kind of confusing...
> 
> What he called an alligator gar is actually most likely a florida gar which is true that what he has in his tank will not grow bigger than what he called a Florida gar..l


Charles, you're awesome. I love your customer service, in fact, the last time we spoke on here I told you I would gladly drive double the distance to your place rather than to king eds. The only time I was at your place you spent an hour speaking to me about various fish species and proper care on top of the fish I was buying. You are awesome, I will buy from you any chance I get.

However, if it is indeed true that this guy mis ID'd the gar, it's just another strike against him. I specifically told him I was looking for a florida gar and not an alligator gar. He should know what he has in stock as well as provide the correct information to go along with them.


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## Momobobo (Sep 28, 2010)

Dawna said:


> I don't think the guy in kinged is purposely trying to mislead you so he can sell off the fishes, I just think he lacks the correct knowledge because hes mostly always just "partially" correct.


For most employees/owners of specialty fish stores, I would agree. But this guy has been in the business for years, he knows a lot, like it takes money to run a business 

I rarely go to King Eds anymore, at least not for live stock. I went to grab some equipment because they are the only store in town that stocks certain things. A lot of competition for the freshwater king title in the lower mainland 

I agree, do your research before purchase. Even the most experienced employee has gaps in their knowledge. Not all fish store employees are out to make a sale, sometimes we just don't know 



> Nothing new... sounds like 99% of all the shops I have been to. Nice thing is king ed's is 99% better then most of those other shops in terms of price and african cichlid selections.


I wouldn't agree on either points. Almost all specialty fish stores/our sponsors in this area have very knowledgeable employees/owners that will tell you if it won't work in the long run, or even refuse sale. They may encourage you to purchase a suitable replacement within the store, but you can't blame them it's their job  Also King Eds...I would not say their prices are extraordinary at all, above average or at par for the most part. (These sponsors of ours make it hard to compete  )


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

King Ed is a sponsor here. Usually sponsor will address this type of concerns when it comes up on the forum. May be someone should direct him to this thread so he could have a chance to know what happened and perhaps explain his side of the story?


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## randylahey (Jun 25, 2013)

That's a shame. I'm in there every 2 weeks for mice and have never had a bad experience with anyone. I was in there today to get a couple of things that other places just dont have. I talked to ron and his wife for a few minutes and they're always awesome. I think I know who you're talking about but, I haven't had a problem with him. Then again, I didn't ask him any questions and just told him what I wanted. Also, I haven't purchased livestock from them in a while because they didn't have what I wanted.
You always seem to hear this story about one place or another. I had a 50g when I was just starting out. I bought 3 common plecos from another store. I was told they wouldn't get big and I bought them not knowing any better. They ended up getting way too big and I just gave them away here. I didn't complain because it was my fault for buying something without knowing. From then on, I knew the info about what I bought.

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## fishdragon (Nov 8, 2010)

Overall the King Ed is good, I am luck I live very close to them;-)

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## theinnkeeper (Sep 12, 2011)

When I bought my Fluval Shrimp Stratum from there 2 years ago. 6 Bags of it. The guy assured me it was best substrate for shrimps. Boy was he wrong...


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## Kimrocks (Aug 30, 2011)

It is similar to walking into a Car dealership.

Some Car Sales people are very honest and upfront - making sure that their product meets your requirements (Ready not to make a sale if not appropriate).

Most however will just sell you anything with 4 wheels on that resembles a car (Commission based selling) - they will even promise their first born to make the sale - : ).

If you walk in with no idea of what you want and with no prior research - you are basically flipping a coin and hoping like hell the Sales guy you end up dealing with is the Honest one. 

After getting burnt a few times, including similar "Plant purchase" situation with same guy referred to by many above - I now know a little better (what to know, who to avoid, etc.). 

The Silver Lining: We all walk away a little bit smarter after the lessons have been learnt - : ).


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## donjuan_corn (May 6, 2010)

I've been there over 50-100 times. I know exactly who you are talking about and yes he is more money driven, and most of the time he knows what he is talking about but he doesn't have patience for too many questions which in my opinion is pretty horrible. 

It's like walking into a mechanic needing an oil change and walking out with a brand new transmission when nothing was wrong. I do my research before I go, know what I need and I get it. The shop itself is really nice and has lots of variety so I won't stop going, I just won't go to ask questions unless I talk to Ron.


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## Smiladon (Apr 23, 2010)

Car Sales Guy + Honest = Oxymoron 

In short, I agree with the fish department guy and his selling strategy + attitude problems. I've experienced both.
But I must stress the fact that the rest of the people there are VERY NICE.

I go there to buy all sorts of stuff and always have a good experience. I mostly deal with Ron & Cathy. 
I just don't buy fish there anymore (for obvious reasons). 
One funny experience to share is that the person in question was trying to sell me Tin Foil barbs (medium-big size) for $120 a piece. There was no price tag on the tank they were in.

Anyways, I agree with the others and would recommend that any bad experiences be brought to the attention of Ron. The "guy in question" might not be fired, but Ron will try to set things right for you.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Interesting that it sounds like everyone knows how this person is, and lots have had bad experience with this one particular person. 
Has it been this way for a long time or is he a new hire?


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## charles (Apr 21, 2010)

To be fair, he is actually not that bad once you get to know him and his background. Most of the time, he is all alone there. I know he can use a bit of customer service refreshment course, but he does what he can do help everyone. Believe me, not everyone knows everything about a fish. I made lots of ID-mistake all the time. But I am not as busy as Kinged; wish I am though... He has to be able to help everyone and like I said before, he is alone most of the time.

Now imagine you are a customer and you have to wait long before a question is answered, you most likely will walk away and not buy anything. He is trying so hard to prevent that.
Now imagine hundreds and thousands of fish coming in and out of the store, it is very hard for him to learn everything about them. To save time, he will trust what his suppliers' ID and sell the products and fish without doing much search about it.


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## Pamela (Apr 21, 2010)

I've had good experiences with the person in question (I've been shopping there for over 5 years). He's told me not to buy certain fish there because they didn't ship well, or are too aggressive, etc. He's also always very happy to see my little girl & plays with her, she loves going there and I have time to check out all the tanks.


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## adanac50 (Apr 26, 2010)

Smiladon said:


> Car Sales Guy + Honest = Oxymoron
> 
> In short, I agree with the fish department guy and his selling strategy + attitude problems. I've experienced both.
> But I must stress the fact that the rest of the people there are VERY NICE.
> ...


$120 Tin Foil barbs...hmmm....no wonder the fish room is a ghost town when I go there...prices are a little wacky on most things.

Having said that, I like King Ed's, but I mostly go for food or equipment...but if I ever need a $120 Tin Foil barb, I know where to go.


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## Momobobo (Sep 28, 2010)

Its been this way for aloooooong time. Since I was still a little brat (Bear in mind that was not very long ago for me )


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

<sighs> wish I could say that lol


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## Vman (Jan 20, 2011)

He got mad at me once, for wanting certain fish,and handed me a net and told me to catch them myself. I found it funny.But it wasn't funny when my girlfriend and I bought a $600 Kakariki parrot with pneumonia.We took the bird to the vets and found out it had pneumonia.So we took it back and demanded our money back.Good try but no $.They gave us another bird and guess what?Pneumonia again.So another Vet visit paid. The vet said that the ace is too humid to keep birds and that is probably why they keep getting sick. So this time I told them that I am not leaving without my money back.I stood there for about 45 min and kept talking about it,loudly,in front of customers and finally got my money back.


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## Junior D (Apr 7, 2012)

Been going to King Ed's for many years...

Know who you're referring to and agreed, he can be crabby....LOL!

I believe he is a brother or cousin of either the husband or wife thus, it's unlikely that complaints will foster anything other than an apology.

I go there for equipment and maintenance items as well as the occasional livestock....but no livestock recently.

Their pricing is competitive and hours of business are convenient for me...even though I drive almost 40 minutes to get there! JL Aquatics offers even better equipment and supplies pricing (sometimes) but it kind of depends on whether Kathy is around since she always provides a loyalty discount. Only issue with this is not getting the same discount when Kathy is not working!

Cheers,
Junior


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

I think many of us have dealt with him. I no longer ask questions and do my own research. The tough part is the poor cell reception down stairs so its hard to google fish before I buy them. The people who ultimately suffer is new aquarists. 

Im sure people can complain all they want. The reality is....... He is making them money. To some that's all that matters. To others we do this for the love of the hobby. People giving bad fish advice drives me nuts. Its horrible for this hobby and ultimately is why lots of newer fish keepers quit fish keeping. They end up spending way too much money, the tank gets algea and the fish are always fighting or sick. They've been told poor advice and don't have anyone else to turn to. So the tank gets put away and that's it for fish tanks. The more people in this hobby. The more benefits to all of us  

Just my 2 cents. Atleast we have Bcaquaria to help promote and educate each other properly on fish keeping.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

I must say I am surprised that as a sponsor Kind Ed has chosen to let this thread run without at least providing their side of the story.

As Charles said it is hard to work all by himself and that it totally understandable. However, what I do not understand is if he clearly cannot handle dealing with the customers nicely by himself why was he scheduled to work by himself despite numerous complaints? Can the owner/management put someone else on the floor to help him out or schedule him on other shifts? 

Is it true, as jbyoung said, it is because he is making them money? Even if it means offering poor advice and selling sick pets with decease with inflated prices?

I do not know the true story and I would like to hear their side of the story. Their silence is deafening.

Grant used to address all feedback/complaints of IPU promptly and that showed to me how much he cared of his customers' satisfaction and the image of his store.


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## kacairns (Apr 10, 2012)

Fish rookie said:


> I must say I am surprised that as a sponsor Kind Ed has chosen to let this thread run without at least providing their side of the story.
> 
> As Charles said it is hard to work all by himself and that it totally understandable. However, what I do not understand is if he clearly cannot handle dealing with the customers nicely by himself why was he scheduled to work by himself despite numerous complaints? Can the owner/management put someone else on the floor to help him out or schedule him on other shifts?
> 
> ...


Maybe you should go into the store for your first time and interview everyone there to find the answers you're looking for. Can you ask them how come they don't run their business like someone else ran their store that no longer runs a business? I'd be interested in what type of response you get.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Huh??? 
Whatever...


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

I have talked to Ron the owner about this thread. Hopefully he will post on here when he has the chance.


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

Fish rookie said:


> Huh???
> Whatever...


He's actually got a good point rookie. Anyone can type anything on here and give you answers you want to hear. Sometimes best to go see for yourself, especially since you haven't been there. And nobody here can answer your question as nobody here actually knows the truth.
I believe KE's is like J&L and a couple others here, more so for advertising themselves, as opposed to posting specials or defending complaints. They have posted 4 times since becoming a sponsor and haven't logged in 3-4 months or so. There is easily a couple dozen unanswered threads in their section. And Im not saying that in a negative way, it's just how some of the sponsors are. 
And you can't expect everyone to be like Grant either, though it would be nice as he was super helpful and very knowledgeable. I think we should give this thread a break and let Ron input something.... as Anthony stated he had a discussion about this thread with Ron so lets see what happens.


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## Korya (Jun 21, 2013)

I am fairly new to this hobby and I too know who you are talking about but I have had some very good experiences with him and have witnessed him telling people not to get certain fish because they weren't right for the tank they have. I guess what bothers me about this thread is that I don't want intent to deceive to be implied. No, his people skills aren't always the best and yes he is very busy but I have never gotten the feeling that he is trying to be deceptive in order to make a sale. I live very close to them and am in there all the time and for the most part (not always) enjoyed my experiences there. I just don't want him (or anyone for that matter) to feel ganged up on in any way.

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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Diztrbd1 said:


> He's actually got a good point rookie. Anyone can type anything on here and give you answers you want to hear. Sometimes best to go see for yourself, especially since you haven't been there. And nobody here can answer your question as nobody here actually knows the truth.
> I believe KE's is like J&L and a couple others here, more so for advertising themselves, as opposed to posting specials or defending complaints. They have posted 4 times since becoming a sponsor and haven't logged in 3-4 months or so. There is easily a couple dozen unanswered threads in their section. And Im not saying that in a negative way, it's just how some of the sponsors are.
> And you can't expect everyone to be like Grant either, though it would be nice as he was super helpful and very knowledgeable. I think we should give this thread a break and let Ron input something.... as Anthony stated he had a discussion about this thread with Ron so lets see what happens.


Hey John,
I was just saying I wanted to hear their side of their story. My questions were rhetorical. LOL
kcrain obviously did not understand what I was saying but I am not going to have an argument here on a fish forum with someone I have never met. This is not the first time he tried to pick some sort of fight with me or say something sarcastic in my posts which were never directed to him whatsoever. But whatever...
Anyway, going back to the matter in discussion, it is good to bring the owner's attention to this matter because to let this dragged on without hearing his side of the story will only make things worst and hurt his image and reputation, possibly to a large degree.
I appreciate you taking the time to explain that he does not log in that often at all. That is cool. You guys have done a great job letting him know. I would be interested in knowing what he has to say.
Peace.


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

Korya said:


> No, his people skills aren't always the best and yes he is very busy but I have never gotten the feeling that he is trying to be deceptive in order to make a sale.
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


That I totally agree with. I might believe that elsewhere, but never got that feeling there. There are a few LFS I have been to that have had mis-id'd fish or given out incorrect info....it happens. That is why I do as much of my own research as possible before getting a species I am unfamiliar with.


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## kacairns (Apr 10, 2012)

Fish rookie said:


> Hey John,
> I was just saying I wanted to hear their side of their story. My questions were rhetorical. LOL
> kcrain obviously did not understand what I was saying but I am not going to have an argument here on a fish forum with someone I have never met. This is not the first time he tried to pick some sort of fight with me or say something sarcastic in my posts which were never directed to him whatsoever. But whatever...
> Anyway, going back to the matter in discussion, it is good to bring the owner's attention to this matter because to let this dragged on without hearing his side of the story will only make things worst and hurt his image and reputation, possibly to a large degree.
> ...


So what you're saying is... you didn't ask questions to get answers, you just said it to add your own garbage to a thread that has way to much of it to begin with. I would have expected if you wanted to pour gasoline on a fire that you'd at least have first hand experience instead of just having to put your own comments in from the peanut gallery. Thanks for being part of the problem, not the solution =)


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## Dawna (Jul 29, 2013)

If you think you have had bad customer service at KingEd please provide a feedback to Ron or Kathy so they are _aware_ of it and can _improve_. Ranting/posting negative experiences on here isn't going to help do anything. All these negative experiences are only contributing biase perspective to other BCA members about KingEd which is a clear intention given the title of this thread. Words can be posted online by anyone, but it takes a real identity to confront the owners about it and find a solution for it.

Many negative experiences have been posted on this thread, but how many of them have been expressed to them personally? If there are many upset customers that speak out about it to them, then they will have to address the issue. But if there is only one or two complaints out of many people that come and go every day to buy fishes, they would think its just one of those few oddballs that have their own opinions about the freshwater section.

Don't add fuel to this thread, demanding an answer from KingEd when you haven't even addressed it to them yourself personally. If you had a bad experience, why is it that YOU get to post the complaint here and have OTHER BCA members [third party] help you do the dirty work of notifying the owners when they did not take part in that bad experience? Why not instead have YOU go notify the owners of your bad experience so you can give a first hand feedback to them.

Personally I don't think people should complain without giving the store a chance to stand. Without addressing the issue to them personally, they wouldn't know, so how would you expect their side of the story?

This isn't just about KingEd but with any other pet stores. No, not just pet stores but any stores. That is why many big franchise stores with well-maintained sites have a customer service or feedback option. Stores are usually open to suggestions on how they can improve and satisfy customers. Silence is indeed deafening on _their_ end


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Dawna said:


> If you think you have had bad customer service at KingEd please provide a feedback to Ron or Kathy so they are _aware_ of it and can _improve_. Ranting/posting negative experiences on here isn't going to help do anything. All these negative experiences are only contributing biase perspective to other BCA members about KingEd which is a clear intention given the title of this thread. Words can be posted online by anyone, but it takes a real identity to confront the owners about it and find a solution for it.
> 
> Many negative experiences have been posted on this thread, but how many of them have been expressed to them personally? If there are many upset customers that speak out about it to them, then they will have to address the issue. But if there is only one or two complaints out of many people that come and go every day to buy fishes, they would think its just one of those few oddballs that have their own opinions about the freshwater section.
> 
> ...


Read Vman's story about the parrots... He brought it up with them, had to fight hard, and after his second time in bringing it up with them he had to tell every customer that walked in to the store in front of the owners for close to an hour before he finally got his money back.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Fish rookie, kacairns... Let's keep this cordial and professional eh? No need for an argument on here, this is just to spread awareness...


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## stratos (Apr 21, 2010)

*Many of us use social media to complain to companies: poll*
Amanda Wawryk November 19, 2013 9:21 am

VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - British Columbians are not shy about taking their complaints to social media. But a lot of people aren't happy with the way our grievances are dealt with.

Despite a third of us having complained about a brand or company through sites like Facebook or Twitter, only a quarter of us are satisfied with the way it was handled.

"About 10 per cent were offered some kind of a discount or coupon. But for the most part, it's really met with a big silence," says Steve Mossop with Insights West.

He tells us says the average person complains about five times or more about various brands.

"The number one on the hit list is restaurants, followed by transit experiences and [telecommunications] and retail experiences. And then we like to complain about technology, airlines, and hotels."

Mossop believes a lack of response can be just as damaging to a company's reputation as the complaint itself.

Many of us use social media to complain to companies: poll | News1130


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## Dawna (Jul 29, 2013)

Master wilkins said:


> Read Vman's story about the parrots... He brought it up with them, had to fight hard, and tell every customer that walked in to the store in front of the owners before he finally got his money back.


But it got resolved. The owners were aware of it, and he eventually got his money back. With one complaint, it DOES take a lot more to fight back, but if many customers are dissatisfied about the same thing, then they will address the problem as a whole. At least Vman didn't post a complaint here and did nothing to resolve it first. There is one thing I love about Ebay is that they have the feedback options and before reporting or filing complaint to a seller, the buyer must address the issue/complaint personally to the seller before having Ebay involved. There are many cases where issues can be resolved by using this method.

This only means that, without even trying, you won't know if you can come to an agreement or not


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## jhj0112 (Jul 30, 2013)

Dawna said:


> If you think you have had bad customer service at KingEd please provide a feedback to Ron or Kathy so they are _aware_ of it and can _improve_. Ranting/posting negative experiences on here isn't going to help do anything. All these negative experiences are only contributing biase perspective to other BCA members about KingEd which is a clear intention given the title of this thread. Words can be posted online by anyone, but it takes a real identity to confront the owners about it and find a solution for it.
> 
> Many negative experiences have been posted on this thread, but how many of them have been expressed to them personally? If there are many upset customers that speak out about it to them, then they will have to address the issue. But if there is only one or two complaints out of many people that come and go every day to buy fishes, they would think its just one of those few oddballs that have their own opinions about the freshwater section.
> 
> ...


I have to respectfully disagree.. Yes you are right about providing feedback to the owner(s). However, Some have talked to the owner and it has not been changed. Also, I don't think many people would wait until owner is available to talk(it seems to me that they are always busy) especially people are extremely disappointed.

As for me, I have talked to the owner about the issue but I have not been back to the kinged yet.. If it was not for this thread, I wouldn't have given them chances so it is somewhat positive.

To me, posting negative experience is part of sharing information. It would be very nice if all comments are positive/nice but it does not happen in real world...

I think the intention of master wilkins is to inform BCAers, not to flame a person or store.. Having said this, I will wait until Kinged's responds to this or pay a visit to Kinged this weekend to speak to the owner( good excuse for me to go there lol)


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

Thank you jhj0112, that is exactly what I intended by starting this thread. Many people, myself included have had bad experiences there and have complained. Some issues have been resolved, some have not.

My most recent issue was when I bought the Niger cat for a friend on the island. As he was netting them out one got his side fins stuck in the mesh. I heard the crack as he pulled out the bones from the fish. When the three were in the bucket he had out for me to choose from them I asked for the biggest one, specifically not the one he had just damaged irreparably, he grabbed it and walked over to his bagging station. I went upstairs to ask my friend if he wanted a gar over the phone as the downstairs has no reception, the same gar I mentioned in an earlier post. I came back downstairs to find he had already bagged it for me. I went upstairs to pay, drove home to maple ridge, floated the bag, and saw that he had switched the fish I wanted for the one he had just mutilated! I phoned in an outrage, they told me I could bring it back to exchange it no problem... But I was already way out in maple ridge... 

I had to drive all they way back through horrible rush hour traffic, because this guy switched fish on me.


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## DBam (Aug 9, 2010)

kacairns said:


> Maybe you should go into the store for your first time and interview everyone there to find the answers you're looking for. Can you ask them how come they don't run their business like someone else ran their store that no longer runs a business? I'd be interested in what type of response you get.


Lol Kevin that made my day, "they don't run their business like someone else ran their store that no longer runs a business". Its funny and it's true.

The silence is deafening. So deafening. But it's always been deafening. They'll probably only post a Boxing Day sale flier between now and 2014, maybe except for this little incident. People keyboard-crusading against a business that actively promotes and supports your complaint medium (and hobby) through sponsorship funding... That's kind of messed up. And then to sit here and say "wow the silence is so deafening XD" when they obviously don't do any interacting on the forum; even more messed up. There've already been suggestions for you on how to address this problem. However, it is entertaining.


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## Master wilkins (Dec 10, 2012)

This thread isnt about answers, its not about resolving an issue. Its about making the not so well informed cautious when they go there next.


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## kacairns (Apr 10, 2012)

Master wilkins said:


> This thread isnt about answers, its not about resolving an issue. Its about making the not so well informed cautious when they go there next.


ummmm.....

Wouldn't it be better suited to get the issue resolved and the answers people seem to want, then threads like this wouldn't be required. In fact making a statement like that seems to point to that this is a direct flame of a forum sponsor and you never intended nor wanted them to take action, you just want to bad mouth them.


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## cgjedi (Nov 11, 2013)

As someone getting back into the hobby and not knowing which fish store is worth checking out, this thread is very valuable to me. I can cross King Ed off of my list to visit until someone reports back that they are serious about solving the issues that people here have brought up. Thanks for the info.


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

cgjedi said:


> As someone getting back into the hobby and not knowing which fish store is worth checking out, this thread is very valuable to me. I can cross King Ed off of my list to visit until someone reports back that they are serious about solving the issues that people here have brought up. Thanks for the info.


Well that would be very unfortunate since they are one of the oldest and most well stocked LFS in BC. Taking some comments posted on the internet and deciding to "write off" a store because of a few disgruntled customers doesn't sound like a great idea. Go there and judge for yourself, IMHO.

As for myself and my family, we LOVE going to King Ed's. Kathy always has a smile and some candy for my girls. Ron is a very good friend who gives me the best deal he can. The rest of the staff are friendly with us and we will continue to support them.

Just picked up a Sohal Tang for under a hundred which is half the price of anywhere else!!!! Shops that give me good service, good products and good deals get my hard earned $$. King Ed's does all this in spades.


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## Vancitycam (Oct 23, 2012)

Repeating things over and over and expecting a different out come is the definition of insanity. I have been to king eds had good experience and not so good but thats negotiating with price im a tough customer soo i wouldnt it put it all on him. If you were not satisfied make a complaint and shop else where it's simple. There is enough competion to serve us hobbyists. I also always hear you pumping the tires for your friend at boslys or something that can get anybody anything so why not just shop there and skip the drive and the repeated horrible experience you were getting at this store. 

I tried to keep my .02 out this thread but it has gotten to be just nonsense. Deal with problems more personally like vman did its more respectful. Don't like don't buy it's your money just walk out.


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## Dawna (Jul 29, 2013)

Master wilkins said:


> I went upstairs to ask my friend if he wanted a gar over the phone as the downstairs has no reception, the same gar I mentioned in an earlier post. I came back downstairs to find he had already bagged it for me. I went upstairs to pay, drove home to maple ridge, floated the bag, and saw that he had switched the fish I wanted for the one he had just mutilated! I phoned in an outrage, they told me I could bring it back to exchange it no problem... But I was already way out in maple ridge...


 should of looked at the fish you paid for some time between getting the bag of fish and paying to make sure it's the one you chose but mainly for other cases is to make sure it does not look ill or show signs of diseases. Its like buying clothes, should always look to make sure there's no hidden holes or loose thread on the clothes before purchasing. Or maybe it's just me.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

I will respect the moderators' wishes and wait till they give their side of the story before I draw my own conclusion. 
A lot of people in Richmond have not been to King Ed just like a lot of people have never been to IPU Richmond. A lot of people will do a research online for reviews before they decide if they want to take the time to visit a store. Be that it may not be the best way, it is the facts of life, and is what a lot of potential customers do.
Not suggesting they should run their business like Grant did, and I have never in any form or manner implied that they should. I was merely trying to use Grant to point out as an example that when an owner does take the time to respond to complaints in a timely fashion it installs confidence and shows others that he cares about customer satisfaction and his reputation. The new IPU owner and Rick are some other examples that come to mind. They make an extra effort to address customers' concerns and deal with complaints and issues in a timely manner. When someone wants to search for a business to spend their money on, these kinds of things are important. 
I feel that when you advertise on a forum on the Internet you are inadvertently opened to both praise and criticism. You get much more exposure but also risk more damage when things are not handled well. One has to take the good with the bad--every once in a while you will have issues but it is how you handle issues that tells potential customers what your priorities are, and how much you care about customer satisfaction.
Because of the impact online reviews have on a business, I always try to post positive review on a business when I have had a good experience; when I do not, I will deal with the business privately first.
I understand and respect that they do not post here often. I only said what I said in the spirit of offering my opinion in a positive and constructive manner, from my perspective as a potential customer and a fish hobbyist. Just my .0002 if you may.
Since Anthony has informed them of the issues here I hope they will take the time to respond or may be ask Anthony to respond on behalf of them if they are too busy to.
I will not post in this thread anymore until then.


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## Reckon (Jul 25, 2012)

Master wilkins said:


> This thread isnt about answers, its not about resolving an issue. Its about making the not so well informed cautious when they go there next.


For someone who doesn't shop there enough to be familiar with which staff member is more knowledable, which ones seem to care more, which ones provide the better service; I'm glad this thread was brought up. I will of course always enter any new shopping experience with as little bias and as much a neutral opinion as possible, but I will also do my due diligence - that includes reading the opinions and experiences of my peers and considering both the positives and negatives. I do this in the same way I visit restaurants. I check the reviews of that restaurant beforehand and if a fellow peer communicates a poor experience with a dish, when many others report that they like what they ordered, then it is only wise that I give the dish more attention before I order it and while I eat from it.

This thread for me is simply a caution, I won't avoid this store simply from the op's post, but I will certainly be even more careful with who I work with while I am there. I appreciate the op's opinion and I consider that his shared experience as a service to the community.

I find it interesting that more than one person has now chimed up and noticed that a particular staff member seems to provide subpar service, considering this is communicated from a community of enthusiasts (and most likely the most loyal repeat customers), as a business owner I would take this into consideration.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

cgjedi said:


> As someone getting back into the hobby and not knowing which fish store is worth checking out, this thread is very valuable to me. I can cross King Ed off of my list to visit until someone reports back that they are serious about solving the issues that people here have brought up. Thanks for the info.


I think this is whats important. Peoples opinions for a new hobbiest to hear. People should be aware of issues we are all having or had. Unfortunatly the view of one employee is effecting the rest of the store. I had never gone to King Eds up until 3 years ago. Im glad I started going there because its a candy store for Adults  Ill admit I dont visit as often anymore. I was also annoyed when I found out a loach I bought gets huge and was told otherwise. Ive still visited since than and will to continue to visit. Just now Im aware of whats going on. "Fool me once, shame on you, Fool me twice, shame on ME!.

The truth is they have good prices on equipment, tanks and all fish products. Their BOXING DAY SALE is awesome. Its month long, not a day long. They carry so much stuff in that store it can be overwhelming but if you are looking for an odd ball part they most likely have it or will order it in

The down fall to the place is the plants. 75% are bog plants and will not survive fully submerged. They will continue to sell them and fail to mention that. They are $2.99. Which is cheapest around. The catch is they will die. So stay away from the plants $2.99 plants. The $4.99 and up are sometimes okay but always a gamble. They are freshly cut and never have any roots. Ive learned to stay away from no root plants.

This store is a high volume, make money establishment. Thats a fact and making money isn't a bad thing. I wish I could make more. The old saying of the customer is always right might not be top priority there but we all know that and continue to go there so a change most likely isn't in the future

It is, what it is. Go check it out and form your own opinion. You'll be glad you did


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## crimper (Oct 20, 2010)

I don't understand why people will jump on the gun and slam a fish store just like that without knowing or not even trying to go to that store and see it your self. A bad customer service incident, from one employee doesn't mean they are a bad company and don't deserve your business. We could go on and on with this and won't resolve anything.

As many of us here that met Ron and Cathy have good experiences with them. They are in the business longer than any pet store in BC for a reason. 99.9% of the time that I went there, I am happy on what I got especially when Ron is there who'll give me crazy deals.

Use your diligence people and not be judgemental here, see it for your self before you jump on the gun.


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## Reckon (Jul 25, 2012)

jbyoung00008 said:


> Ive still visited since than and will to continue to visit. Just now Im aware of whats going on. "Fool me once, shame on you, Fool me twice, shame on ME!
> It is what it is


Hey buddy,
First of all, I want to say I 'like' this post. I really do. But I had a good laugh when I saw your quote. It is evidence that people (a generalization, not specifically referring to you) are quite cynical about business. 
Yes, people should do their due diligence so they don't get fooled x2; you can call me an idealist, but I think businesses should not continue to fool people over and over again.

It should not be what it is. I think what most people think is more like this: 
"fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, WTF?! I'm outta here." And that's not good for anyone.

Businesses #1 priority is profit but who wouldn't want to make more money? That happens by keeping your customers happy.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

Reckon said:


> Hey buddy,
> First of all, I want to say I 'like' this post. I really do. But I had a good laugh when I saw your quote. It is evidence that people (a generalization, not specifically referring to you) are quite cynical about business.
> Yes, people should do their due diligence so they don't get fooled x2; you can call me an idealist, but I think businesses should not continue to fool people over and over again.
> 
> ...


Hey. I totally agree Lawson but Im think of my self as a realist. Id love for every LFS to give great info. Worry about money second etc...... But its just not going to happen. Things now a days are cut throat. Make money first worry about the outcome second. Not all buisnesses are like this but lots are. Its kinda sad 

Im in no way saying what is happening is okay because it's totally not IMO. I voiced my opinion in an earlier post saying how much it bothers me when LFS or people give poor fish keeping advice to new fish keepers. Sometimes it's on purpose and sometimes not. I just dont see a change in sight. Ill continue battling for newbies to have nice tanks too but at what cost??? Its a losing battle.

Now a days the internet is easilly available that as a customer you need to do your homework before buying anything. I google everything before I buy it. Fish supplies and house supplies I mean everything. Why? Because you have to. Its a make money world and if people don't want to see that, other people will take your money.

Im in no way picking a fight with you Lawson. We've met enough times to see eye to eye. We both want people to succeed in fish keeping!


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## Reckon (Jul 25, 2012)

jbyoung00008 said:


> Hey. I totally agree Lawson but Im think of my self as a realist. Id love for every LFS to give great info. Worry about money second etc...... But its just not going to happen. Things now a days are cut throat. Make money first worry about the outcome second. Not all buisnesses are like this but lots are. Its kinda sad
> 
> Im in no way saying what is happening is okay because it's totally not IMO. I voiced my opinion in an earlier post saying how much it bothers me when LFS or people give poor fish keeping advice to new fish keepers. Sometimes it's on purpose and sometimes not. I just dont see a change in sight. Ill continue battling for newbies to have nice tanks too but at what cost??? Its a losing battle.
> 
> ...


No fight picked. Like you I'd rather be fighting fish on a line  I am only contemplating your quote. I know you are reasonable and a realist.

I can see how the OP opens up a bit to trust the person who is supposed to be the expert only to be disappointed. As someone who is supposed to be a 'specialist' in my field. I get irritated when my patients tell me what they think I should do for them because they read about something related online. However, I recognize that many people have been burned by these 'experts,' so they try to get a bit more educated either to protect themselves or to come to terms with what the expert is telling them.

Fortunately, in this modern age, we do have the internet, smart phones, urbanspoon, seriouslyfish, aquaticplantcentral, and of course bcaquaria to help with being smart consumers. This creates more exposure for businesses, for better (marketing) or for worse (criticism). It is an artifact of the times. I know that I, as a professional who also caters to clients it's a lot more exposure than I'm comfortable with, but it is something I have to accept. Increased exposure means I can grow my business faster but it also means I may need to address and probably more importantly mitigate getting flamed online (by applying good business services and practices).

The beauty of a community like BCAquaria is that some of us get to know each other. We learn whose comments/concerns/reviews/opinions are legitimate and whose are utter garbage. Hopefully, the comments we find on here are not the same ignorant statements we often see on twitter.


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

*


Master wilkins said:



This thread isnt about answers, its not about resolving an issue. Its about making the not so well informed cautious when they go there next.

Click to expand...

 I believe this thread has gone far enough, Since it isn't about answers or resolving an issue , which you really should have taken this up with the owner in the first place, you have said more than enough about being cautious. Seeing the same few people repeatably posting on this thread is making it look sound a broken record. This is about one employee, not the whole store, yet it would appear that people are going to judge the business as a whole over this one person. Rather than watch it turn into a bash fest or become uncivil. I am now closing this thread. There has been more than enough "opinions/ experiences/complaints" shared and it appears that nobody wants to wait for a reply from the ownership.... it is now officially closed!

Ron/King Eds, if you wish to reply to this thread... please contact one of the mods.*


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