# Calling out to all mold and carpet plant experts



## jaekwong (Jul 9, 2013)

I'm having a NIGHTMARE experience with carpet plants. They seem to always get mould and then they melt the plants within 2 days. Has happend with my glossos and hc's and my latest round of hc's.

I've posted and done a lot of searching and this common with DSM'ers.
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I've posted about this on The planted tank and on here sevearl times about this issue but no one seems to be able to figure it out...

So im reaching out to the community, is there anyone that is in the Metrotown/Patterson area that would be kind enough to have a look at my tank in person? I'm hoping to have someone who has a indepth knowledge with plants...

btw these plants were bought from aquaflora. great guys there and all my rotala's are doing great... just carpet plants....

THANK YOU for any responses


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## TheBigCheese (Oct 1, 2012)

Was the mold there before you flooded the tank? Can you share your setup and explain your routine for the DSM? If you're sealing off the tank with saran wrap or something your internal temps could be getting pretty high. You Need to ventilate it often and mist it, but don't mist it too often. Over misting will cause mold. There's a lot of potential factors.


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## jaekwong (Jul 9, 2013)

No the plants were emersed .. i didn't do DSM

Here's my setup:

The tank:
- 20 gallons
- injected c02
- growng 3 different species of rotala's all of which are doing and growing wonderfully
- have some shrimps and rasboras in there
ph 6.4
ammonia 0
nitrites 0
nitrates 40
ei dosing (I've cut half now because i have CRS and Amano shrimps)

So I've been struggling with carpet plants. They seem to start off getting white spidery hair on it and then they start melting almost 2-3 days after i planted them. I thought it may have been mould/mold but I'm not sure.

Anyways here's whats happening

1st) planted glossos -> melted -> all died
2nd) planted hc's -> melted -> all died
3rd) planted hc's -> i see them slowly dying (it's only been 2 days)



TheBigCheese said:


> Was the mold there before you flooded the tank? Can you share your setup and explain your routine for the DSM? If you're sealing off the tank with saran wrap or something your internal temps could be getting pretty high. You Need to ventilate it often and mist it, but don't mist it too often. Over misting will cause mold. There's a lot of potential factors.


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## blurry (May 10, 2010)

What lighting and substrate you using?


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## jaekwong (Jul 9, 2013)

blurry said:


> What lighting and substrate you using?


ADA Amazonian Aquasoil

Satellite Current Freshwater LED +


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## TheBigCheese (Oct 1, 2012)

Okay just so we're straight on definitions.

*Emersed *= "standing out of or rising above a surface (as of a fluid)" so that would be the DSM, growing out of the water. 
*Immersed *= "submerge in a liquid" so growing submerged in water.

An aquarium is like a fire triangle. To have a fire you need Oxygen/Heat/Fuel and it has to be balanced.

For a planted tank, To narrow it down, you have to look at 4 things:  Light, Co2, Substrate & Nutrients. 

Judging by your description you have injected CO2 you have Nutrients (EI dosing) You have excellent substrate, and lighting is questionable as I don't know enough about LED and their output.
I imagine that it would be sufficient so that leads me to believe CO2 might be the main culprit .

Any details on your Co2, Pressurized? DYI? Bubbles per second? How is it diffused into your water column?

HC and Glosso are huge CO2 hogs especially if you buy them from aquaflora or other nurseries. This is because they're grown Emersed (ie: out of the water).
The plants are used to being able to absorb lots of CO2 from the air around them. They're choked off when you put them into a tank without enough Co2 to 
meet their demands thus they melt, cant grow, die off and start to decay. Lighting also plays an important roll, to dim and it wont grow, to much and you'll burn them.

1 more question, how long has this tank been up?


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## jaekwong (Jul 9, 2013)

TheBigCheese said:


> Okay just so we're straight on definitions.
> 
> *Emersed *= "standing out of or rising above a surface (as of a fluid)" so that would be the DSM, growing out of the water.
> *Immersed *= "submerge in a liquid" so growing submerged in water.
> ...


Thank you for explaining the difference between emersed and immersed.

You bring up a very interesting and logical point about the injected C02 - would have never thought of that. I HAVE been having c02 issues and realized it has been leaking from the bubble counter (just figured it out today). And yes HC and Glosso are purchased from aquaflora.

I'm leaving my lights on for 8 hours, all my ohter plants are doing wonderful except for the glossos and HC's.

The tank has been up for 3 weeks now. I've gone through 2 batches of the HC's. Now that I JUST fixed my C02 - perhaps I will have a better chance? I have also just switched to running it 24/7 since I have shrimps now. This will help minimize the PH swings. With it running 24 hours i am having 1 bubble per 3 seconds.

Is this sufficient? I don't want to turn it any higher because my ph is at a very low 6.0


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## TheBigCheese (Oct 1, 2012)

I'd recommend looking at our local shops for a Drop Checker and getting your CO2 in check before purchasing and trying some more glosso or HC. Having a drop checker is important especially if you have shrimp. PH swings are confusing when it comes to CO2, and I'm sure there's some who would disagree with me, but PH swings from CO2 are not as harmful as people imagine. I can go into the details later if you're interested but it has to do with PH swings from CO2 injection vs PH swings from KH that cause fish/shrimp problems. Buy yourself a good drop checker, sort out your Co2 to give you "green" on your checker and you'll be set. Start low 0.5 bps to 1 bps and see how that goes. keeping a few pieces of crushed coral in your filter helps keep your ph/kh in balance too, but that's another story.

You don't necessarily have to have your CO2 on 24/7 as you'll just be wasting it at night. Again look at the fire triangle, at night plants don't grow nearly as fast as when the lights are on, it's all a balance. Light on, Co2 on, Nutrients get absorbed. Lights off, less demand for Co2, Less demand for nutrients. If you Really want to get it dialed in buy yourself two timers. 1 timer for your Co2 and 1 timer for your lights. Aim for getting your CO2 levels "in the green" 1 hour before the lights come on. I personally just have my lights and Co2 come on at the same time and I don't have any issues.

I'd recommend putting your diffuser underneath the outflow of your filter, this way you can try and get it evenly distributed via the water flow through out your tank.

again, it's a game of balance, keep up with the EI dosing or whichever way works best for you. Keep the lighting and Co2 balanced and you're guaranteed to have a successful tank with any plants you want.


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## jaekwong (Jul 9, 2013)

TheBigCheese said:


> I'd recommend looking at our local shops for a Drop Checker and getting your CO2 in check before purchasing and trying some more glosso or HC. Having a drop checker is important especially if you have shrimp. PH swings are confusing when it comes to CO2, and I'm sure there's some who would disagree with me, but PH swings from CO2 are not as harmful as people imagine. I can go into the details later if you're interested but it has to do with PH swings from CO2 injection vs PH swings from KH that cause fish/shrimp problems. Buy yourself a good drop checker, sort out your Co2 to give you "green" on your checker and you'll be set. Start low 0.5 bps to 1 bps and see how that goes. keeping a few pieces of crushed coral in your filter helps keep your ph/kh in balance too, but that's another story.
> 
> You don't necessarily have to have your CO2 on 24/7 as you'll just be wasting it at night. Again look at the fire triangle, at night plants don't grow nearly as fast as when the lights are on, it's all a balance. Light on, Co2 on, Nutrients get absorbed. Lights off, less demand for Co2, Less demand for nutrients. If you Really want to get it dialed in buy yourself two timers. 1 timer for your Co2 and 1 timer for your lights. Aim for getting your CO2 levels "in the green" 1 hour before the lights come on. I personally just have my lights and Co2 come on at the same time and I don't have any issues.
> 
> ...


Actually, good point I am going to fix my drop checker, the drop checker fluid it came with just didn't make sense. I am using 4dkh solution, but the blue liquid it came with just wasn't accurate. Safe to use API PH test solution with the 4dkh solution instead?

I did use a timer on the light and c02, but believed that not enough c02 was going through because it was leaking a little.

Another thing with EI, I've let off on it this week because I heard full EI dosing can be stressful to the shrimps? Perhaps cut the dosing in half?

Thank you


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