# 10 gallon clean up: Summer Tank. Update Aug 19 pg 5



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

So my niece is off for a great adventure this summer. My parents get the honour of looking after the "grandog", and my niece asked me to look after what's left of her fish. 42 internets to someone who can come up for a good name for the fish, like "grandog".

But I tell you, this little 10 gal is going to be a bit of a project for me, just to clean it up basically.

Thought I'd keep a journal of how it is now, and see what it's like in 2 months, when she gets back.

Here's how they transported it.  All decorations/substrate still in it, and about 50% full of water.









Filled it up with some fresh water.









And an improvised guppy fry home. Deli cup that bettas come in with a lid with holes on it:








(Not a great pic, I left the light off when I took this one).

So, in this tank are a couple of live plants (which are really the only source of filtration right now), a tiger barb, 2 of some other fish, possibly a different kind of barb, and a danio (I think). 
She had a guppy tank, and scooped most of them out and took them to the pet store, but she missed a few, so she threw them in bag in the tank. So there's maybe half a dozen guppy fry, and one medium sized guppy. The medium guppy I put in with the other fish.

The guppies are going to be turtle food (and my niece knows this and is just fine with it). But I figured at their current size, they'd just get sucked right into the ol' FX5 if I put them in the turtle tank. So I'm hoping to get them to grow a bit before they get to meet Ralpheal and Frankie  Plus, I wanted to make sure they didn't have any parasites or anything.

First thing I've got to do with this tank is change the filter cartridge and clean the filter. Looks like it hasn't been changed yet this year  I think I'll just stuff some filter floss in a bag.

Also, I know for a fact the gravel has never been cleaned, so I figured I'd give that a good clean at some point.

I'll post pics of the fish once they get settled a bit, and maybe get you guys to help identify them, and I'll keep this thread updated as a clean it up


----------



## kelly528 (Apr 21, 2010)

I can't wait to see how it turns out!!! I'm sure she'll be surprised when she gets back! I vote you screw some CFLs into the hood and make it a NPT so it will be nice any low maintenance for her when she gets back.

And you probably already figured this, but I would remove the fish before you tackle the gravel. I have even had problems with hydrogen sulphide gas buildup in fine gravel. If there is a solid enough layer of crud at the bottom it will cut oxygen off creating an anaerobic environment.

Have fun and keep us posted!


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

I'm not sure what kind of bulbs the hood has. They're sort of skinny little ones, so I don't know if CFLs will fit.

Thanks for the tip on the gravel! I wasn't sure how I was going to do that just yet. Probably won't be doing that for a couple weeks. Filter first, then I'll get some good bacteria going in the new media before I tear up the gravel.

There's also at least 2 different kinds of snails in there. I'll post those up soon to see if anyone can ID them too


----------



## neven (May 15, 2010)

low wattage CFLs will fit, i've done it when i had my first 10 gallon. sometimes a bit of torque on the socket will keep slightly downwards to make room for the bulb.

as for the gravel. you might want to replace with various grades of pea gravel, gives nice texture and look, and will match whatever pretty stones she wants to put in the tank to make it her own. if she's young a walk on a rocky trail or river will give a nice outting with that purpose in mind. a little water will show her rocks can be pretty without being crystal  the main goal of the gravel is getting those plants rooted right and the gravel is easy to vac


----------



## gimlid (Apr 23, 2010)

I've seen guppys last awhile in turtle tanks before, maybe they will still be there when she gets home.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks Nevel  I'm don't want to really add or change anything in this tank. Basically, just going to get it looking nice again, and try to get the fish healthy.

Gimild - Yeah, I was wondering how long they might last... Frankie is smart, but lazy. Ralph is fast, but dumb. So I'll be taking bets who takes the longest to finish off the guppies 

As promised, a few pics. Haven't done anything with the tank yet.

Firstly, there's 4 different kinds of snails in there! 
1. Domed on the top, swirly on the bottom:









#2









#3








And another one on the gravel:









#4, similar to #3 but not as pointy of shell.









Question: With the snails rooting around in the gravel, is it possible that the toxic buildup isn't as bad as it otherwise could be?

Fishies: Most pics are with flash, since they're some fast moving fish!

The tiger barb already has brightened up since yesterday:









The danio:









Guppy:









These two silver fish, I don't know what they are. Can someone ID them?

















And here you can just see one of the guppy fry in the little hatchery.








Question - About how long before these guys are big enough to actually recognize as guppies? Or how long before they won't get sucked into the filter? I'm thinking I might have to set up something different so they can get some water flow.


----------



## eternity302 (Apr 22, 2010)

ID - Pristella Tetras
Correct me if I'm wrong! =)


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

That's exactly what they look like! I bet that's what they are  Thanks!


----------



## kelly528 (Apr 21, 2010)

Here's the style of CFL I use:










The unconventional format allows for less light bounce than a spiral and since they are oblong they fit nicely into most standard hoods.

The Hagen Life Glos pictures are 15W so 2 of them may be a little high unless you want to do some minor ferts and excel but Coralife sells 10W ones and I have also seen the same type at some hardware stores.


----------



## neven (May 15, 2010)

i call those the retro style rather then unconventional  since they were around before twister CFLs came into the picture.


----------



## gimlid (Apr 23, 2010)

Question - About how long before these guys are big enough to actually recognize as guppies? Or how long before they won't get sucked into the filter? I'm thinking I might have to set up something different so they can get some water flow. 

I would say about a month. Baby guppies are pretty good at staying out of the filter in my tanks and I am running pretty fast filtration (xp-4 and 2217 eheim).
Get them some good fry food, mine also like to pick at romaine lettuce once if softens up a bit (or par boil for 10 secs before adding) but just a small piece for a tank that small.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks for the tip on the guppies! I've just been feeding them crushed up flakes.

On an interesting side note, the adventure actually ended suddenly. Vehicle troubles  So they're back already, but they're going to plan something else, and they're hoping to be off again in a couple days.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Finally, a tank update 
Got around to the filter today. Not sure what brand it is... The lid seems to have mysteriously disappeared between their place and mine.

Filter in all it's dirty glory:









The old cartridge (ick!)









I decided I'd make my own cartridge, like I've done for a couple of my other HOBs. 
So here's the old cartridge picked clean:








I was actually surprised, it's a nicer design than mine. Mine just have an X across them to hold the carbon, but this one has much more support.

Anyhow, put the brace in a piece of stocking, put a bunch of pillow stuffing on both sides of it, and even put a bit of carbon in there for good measure.

















I know, looks awesome, right? 

And here it is in action:









Also picked up a thermometer today.
Next I think I'll give the glass inside and out a good clean, and a partial water change. Then after that, I'm going to tackle that gravel!


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

So cleaning the glass - easier said than done 

Turns out it's that kind of algae that you can't really get off unless you use a razor blade. But I gave it as best a scrub as I could with a paper towel, and it got some of it off, because the water was green when I was done.

Also added a background... It's not quite the right size, but I kind of liked the look of it. I also tried just a black plastic bag, but I liked this better.


----------



## kelly528 (Apr 21, 2010)

Looking good! If you move plants in front of the spots the background doesn't cover you'll forget the background was ever too small!

The filter is a PetCetera house-brand filter... they stopped selling them when they reopened and I never did find the company that manufactured them so yup, you pretty much have to use the little frame-thingy and rig up a DIY filter cartridge.

If you measure it (length of filter box from left to right or something) I can see if its the same size as mine and if so, give you the GPH and model number.


----------



## scherzo (Apr 24, 2010)

Nice job! They won't know what happened to their tank!


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks guys 

Thanks Kelly! I figured it might have been a Petcetera brand filter. I know they picked up a couple filters for like, $3 when they were closing  I would assume it's their 10 gallon rated filter. Left to right, the box is about 13.5 cm.

I'm wondering, for cartridges, if they just bought a different brand that happens to fit in there alright, since the cartridge didn't fit snuggly in the slot, it was kind of loose. 

Good tip on the plants too! I'm going to re-arrange the plants when I do the gravel.


----------



## kelly528 (Apr 21, 2010)

Wow definitely bigger than the ones I have (I have the SF-0103 which is rated for 1-3g tanks and turns over 58 GPH). The box is only 10 cm so you must have the next size up.

And the cartridges are loose on mine too, I think thats sort of the way they are but I can tell from your frame that you definitely have the right cartridge. I have a theory that the petcetera filters may be compatible with the Tetra Whisper Bio-Bag cartridges.


----------



## ncutler (Apr 26, 2010)

As for IDing the snails:

#1 looks to be like baby ramshorn snails - they look very different than when they grow older.

#2 looks like apple snails

#3 looks to be much like Malaysian Trumpet Snails, but there's a few that can look that way.


----------



## ~Lynae (Apr 21, 2010)

#2 snail is a Bladder snail..aka Pond snail, same with the other similar one. There is apparently two very similar kinds, one with a very defined point and one with a chubby little spiral. Which looks like she has both! 
#1 is for sure a Ramshorn
#3 is definately a Malaysian Trumpet 
The tank looks amazing now..!!


----------



## thefishwife (Apr 21, 2010)

It is definitely a petcetra brand as I used to have one. And for cartridges I used these Dynaflo Filter Cartridge #1 - b/c they were so much cheaper then the petcetra ones. I used to get mine at Mr. Pets.

Here's a link to their site to just SHOW you what they look like -

Mr.Pet's

The tanks looking good


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks for the snail ID guys  
If they are malasian trumpet snails, that's a good thing. With luck maybe there's not a toxic buildup under the gravel, if the snails are routing around in there. I think I'll probably still take the fish out, just to play it safe.

Thanks Kim  I might mention that brand, and possibly the Tetra brand that Kelly mentioned if she decides she wants to continue buying cartridges.

For some reason, the tank was looking even better today. Guess with a bit of time the filter sucked out the extra cloudiness from cleaning the glass the other day.









Fish are doing well, the tiger barb is much more colourful than when I first got him. 
The danio seems to spend a lot of time sitting on the bottom... I don't know if that's normal or not. Mind you, he is in with a bunch of fin-nippers...

The guppy fry are starting look a bit more like guppies, but still pretty small.

Here's a bunch of the different snails chilling on one of the shells.









One thing that's interesting that I've noticed about the trumpet snails, the big ones seem to only come out at night. During the day, the smaller ones are around on the glass or the plants, but there's 2 or 3 really big ones that I usually only see "up and about" after the light is off. During the day, they're down in/on the gravel.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Finally got around to the thing I've been dreading... Cleaning the gravel!

Took the fish out, put the barb in a separate container, since he's a meany 









Here's the tank part way through the first change.









And the water the first change:









Didn't look too better after the second change either, but by the third, it looked pretty good.









But you can see there was floaty stuff on the top.









But I turned the filter on for about an hour, and it cleared right up.

And here it is, all cleared up:









A couple of the big snails:









All 5 fish in one pic!









I feel pretty bad for the danio... The barb is always after him, so the danio spends most of his time hiding. He's taken to hiding in the plastic grass:









And here's a recent pic of the guppies. I counted 7 in there.









So now the only thing left that I plan to do with the tank is to scrub up the shells and plastic plants. I didn't do it this time around, since I thought doing such a big water change might disturb the beneficial bacteria.


----------



## Morainy (Apr 21, 2010)

Your tank is looking much cheerier! I'm sure that the plastic plants will wash up nicely once you're ready to do that. It probably was a good idea to wait for awhile, to preserve the bacteria.

Maybe you could trade the danio for another tiger barb? Or the tiger barb for another danio? Tiger barbs are beautiful fish but they're usually friendliest when they have some more barbs to hang around with. 

Your tank cleanup project is fun to read about and it's going to be a great surprise for your relative (niece?). Way to go!


----------



## kelly528 (Apr 21, 2010)

Holy smokes that tank cleaned up well!

If I were you I would talk to her about rehoming the barb & the danio with the kind people of BCA. Reason being that not only will they get too big and / or energetic for a 10g, they are both schooling fish and do better in groups of at least 6. Hence the aggression from the barb (he's trying to school with the danio, treating it like another tiger barb) and the timidity of the danio, who is the sole focus of the tiger barb's 'affections'.


----------



## eternity302 (Apr 22, 2010)

WoW! Alot of good cleaning you're doing =)


----------



## gimlid (Apr 23, 2010)

barbs are always nasty like that to other fish unless they are in a school. when they are in a school they usually only nip at other barbs. they will harrass each other all day by preference.


----------



## swordtail (Apr 24, 2010)

Looking much better. Excellent job cleaning it up.


----------



## Catfish180 (Jul 18, 2010)

Looks way better. I'm not a fan of barbs. They sometimes attack other fish or even their own kind!


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks all 

Yeah, I was even considering dividing the tank, separate the barb, but I wasn't sure if I wanted to go there. Plus I thought with the big guy gone, the tetras might rise up as the nippers and still chase the danio.
When they first set up the tank, they each got to pick out 2 fish, 6 fish total, so that's why there's such an odd assortment. They also went through several fish, after a couple of newbie mistakes, and what's left today are the hardiest survivors. 

Maybe I'll suggest to her when she gets back that she trade in the barb for another danio or something 

Though his colour is much nicer now than when I first got him!  He's almost fluorescent orange!


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Right, again, after some procrastinating, I've done the 2nd biggest job on this tank.
I cleaned the shells, big rocks and plastic plants.

The plants turned out to be pretty tricky to do. I tried my scrub brush first, which got the big stuff off, but what really got the tough stuff off was a thumb-sized piece of green scrubbie.

The leafy plant was the worst, and it came down to pretty much scrubbing individual leaves. Probably way more than a reasonable person would do, but I've never been a reasonable person 










They're back in about a week and a half. I might give the algae on the glass one last go before I give it back to them, but other than that, I'm pretty much done 

Just for a side by side comparison, here's the tank then and now:


----------



## InfraredDream (Jun 24, 2010)

What a difference! They won't recognize it  You did such a wonderful job with the clean up!

Just an off topic question, how is the actual moving of the tank done? Empty part of it and net the fishes or?


----------



## Luke78 (Apr 24, 2010)

Quite the contrast from before to now.Lets hope it stays clean and healthy once it leave your hands.


----------



## Morainy (Apr 21, 2010)

What an improvement! In the photo, it's especially visible with the shell and the rock. I hope that your niece loves it. She is lucky to have you as an uncle. (Aunt?)


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks guys 

Infrared - how did *they* move it? Siphoned out about half the water, left fish and everything else in there, and drove it here (about an hour drive).

My plan to get it back, if nothing else, is to bucket the fish. I was pondering if I should lend them one of my 5g buckets, fill it with tank water, and just drain the tank. That, or just leave some water in the tank, and bring the fish buckets...
I just don't want the tank to crack! I'm so glad it didn't on the way here!

Morainy - I'm her aunt


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

*Last Update (probably)*

My Nieces and family are home, but they didn't want to take the fish tank back just yet since they were pretty full up and it was late when they dropped by. So I decided to do one more update/change to the tank.

I got myself a little razor blade to get some stubborn algae off my 15g. Worked great. So I thought I'd try it on the 10g, and I realized my 15g was way worse for algae than the 10g  So the razor blade had no trouble scraping that bit of extra algae off.

I decided to separate the tiger barb (or the Orange Terror, as I call him ). 
The one tetra who's tail had been nipped down to the nub I figured was well enough to release again, but I didn't want it to happen over again.

So I got out my handy dandy egg crate, and just cut a chunk to size. The danio can swim through it, which isn't a big deal, as long as he can remember how to get back to the other side when he needs to 










I've got it divided about 1/3 and 2/3s of the tank, with the barb in the 1/3 portion. I know it's not ideal, but I figured it would save the others from the misplaced aggression.

If anyone has suggestions for a different division, let me know.

Here's some fishy pics.
The Orange Terror, who isn't overly pleased with his new situation.









Flash washes him out, but he's hard to get a good pic without. But I wanted to show his nice bright orange:









The preggers guppy:









The danio, who is looking rather skinny. He's got quite a personality when he's not being terrorized by the barb. I'm hoping now that the barb is out of the way, he'll fatten up.









When I let the QT'd tetra back into the tank, the two tetras did a little circle dance around each other. It was quite cute ^_^ They of course have been sticking together since.
In this pic, the one who's in front was the one who had his tail chewed off.


















And I had 4 guppy fry remaining. They're about 1.5cm long, and actually look like mini guppies now.
I set up my 2.5g really simply, and put them in there. And I plan to put any new fry in there too.









Here's the 4 fry all together:









Should I put the preggers guppy in the 2.5g, so I don't have to try to fish baby guppies out of the big tank?


----------



## eternity302 (Apr 22, 2010)

=) haha!! Orange terror! Lol!


----------



## jobber (May 14, 2010)

that orange terror does look fierce. the colours and the fins are flared up quite nicely. i wouldn't keep the guppy fries in the big tank. think the barbs will get to them ...fast.

good job on the 10 gallon!


----------



## clintgv (May 6, 2010)

Wow you did a good job on that tank.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks all 

Well, I came into the room to find a couple of eyeballs with tails floating around the tank, so I guess I was a bit slow on taking mama out xD
Anyhow, scooped a handful of babies out, and the scooped mama, who dropped 3 more fry in the net, and now their all in the 2.5g.

The fry are pretty smart (though I guess you have to be if you're only 1/2cm). Several figured out in the big tank that the newly created divider is a good place to hang out. Also found one in the java moss. 

I put a bit of crushed bloodworms in the tank, both for the 4 big guys and also for mama, so hopefully she doesn't eat too many of her young.


----------



## clintgv (May 6, 2010)

Oh nice. Pictures of the 2.5 gal maybe?


----------



## jobber (May 14, 2010)

Congrats on the newbies! Its always exciting to hear spawning of any sort. The kids are going to love them.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks  The kids don't want any guppies. I thought they might want the big one back, but they don't even want her back. And they're also OK with the guppies ending up in the turtle tank.
Before they went on vacation, they had a guppy tank. But they took all the guppies into the pet store since they were sort of done with them and they didn't want to bring me 2 tanks. 
The one big one and the fry that I ended up with just got missed when they took the rest to the pet store, so they threw them in with the others, and said I could give them to the turtles 

Clint - There's one pic of the 2.5g up. Not much to look at. Just a small fake plant and a little chunk of java moss. I've got my mini heater in there too, so that should keep it nice and warm. Think I'll keep it simple.


----------



## BullDog (Apr 21, 2010)

I took the divider out already. The Orange Terror somehow figured out how to get from one side or the other. Though it still provided some relief to the other fish, they could just zip to whatever side the barb wasn't on, I didn't want the barb hurting himself. I'm not sure if he was squeezing against the glass to get through, or jumping over the egg crate, but either way could end not so good for him.

But I did do a little bit of a re-scape. I tilted the two biggest shells up to provide little caves for the other guys to hide in. 









*SHHHH!* We're hiding!









Seems to work pretty well, since down there the barb doesn't catch sight of them easily.


----------



## O.C.D Fishies (Apr 21, 2010)

Thats a good idea. It might be worth it to consider trading someone the barb for a couple other more suitable fish, that way everyone will be happy.


----------

