# Why don't you have Rams and Apistogrammas?



## Kitsune (Jul 17, 2010)

So I am starting to think about what i want in my new 75 gallon tank.

I think I have my heart set on rams and apistgramma's. But I don't seem to hear much about them, and the LFS have very limited (and intermittent) selection. Based on my discussion with Charles, I understand this is partly because they are seasonal fish. But when the stores have them, they disappear instantly. 

So where are they going, and who's keeping them? Are there no discussions because they are too hard to keep, or not discussion worthy? Do you know something that I don't know?


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## jkcichlid (Apr 21, 2010)

I do keep apistos and rams...so I didn't vote in the poll

Great, active colorful fish that if given the correct water parameters should be easy to keep


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## Diztrbd1 (Apr 21, 2010)

I'd love to have Rams myself , but I hear they are hard to keep mostly due to water parameter problems & it's hard enough for me to keep my tanks at a reasonable Ph level as it is lol I'd have them ina heartbeat if I didn't think I'd lose them


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

there should be another category for "other reason"

for me i just don't want to keep those fish atm, i got others on my list of future tanks


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Didn't have a tank where they fit until this next one I'm setting up. Will likely have Apistos in this one.


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## Luke78 (Apr 24, 2010)

Didnt vote on the poll either, ive kept both but prefer apistogrammas.I was lucky to keep half a dozen different apistos and found them to be some interesting dwarf cichlids.They arent actually difficult to keep and are not picky with eating habits,living space,or water.Stability is key , lots of hiding places are a must(caves,rocks,driftwood,almond leaves,plants) are a few to list.Females are just as tough as the males, and are the real "boss" of it all.Males are more colourful , but in some species of apistos the female is just as colourful.Their active through all levels of the aquarium,but come breeding time mid to bottom levels are all theirs and other tankmates may get pushed out.Tankmates include most tetras, bottom feeders,and larger fish.Lower PH levels will allow more breeding and successful offspring. 

Thats off the top of my head sort of speak , will add more if i remember


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## Karen (Apr 22, 2010)

I have a pair of Bolivian rams, and I love them, they are real characters to watch. I chose Bolivians as my "beginner" dwarf cichlid, no problems and no reqrets. I plan on doing some overhauling on the tanks this winter and then I will look for some apistos, though tough to find around Kamloops.


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## Sharkbait (Jun 15, 2010)

I've never kept apistos, but I've tried rams a handful of times and was always unsuccessful. Bad stock I think. They die within days. One batch even brought in worms to my tank. Longest I had rams in my tank was 2 months or so.


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## Mferko (Jun 8, 2010)

i got hooked on african cichlids, started with malawi mbuna and recently i changed to lake tanganyika


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## eternity302 (Apr 22, 2010)

Couldn't vote.. as they myseteriously die one by one!


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## alym (Apr 21, 2010)

Rams have a way of dying more mysteriously than Elvis (who still lives, btw)


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## Luke78 (Apr 24, 2010)

Most if not all apistos will take in a varied diet.Pellets,flakes,bloodworms,
brineshrimp,krill,blackworms, they will even nibble on bottom feeder pellets.Temps they are happy at are between 23-26C some do like cooler temps and others higher , but that range is not bad. They also like lots of shaded areas,so if possible avoid bright light/less lighting hours.Lifespan on most of these guys goes from 1-1.5--3 yrs.Dont live that long compared to other fish.Lots of personality,attitude,and crazy breeding methods for some.Hope that helps.


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## bonsai dave (Apr 21, 2010)

I would go with apisto's over rams just because of the varieties you can get but be careful with how many you put in your tank. I had 12 at one time and over a period of a few months the lg male decided to clean house and kill 10 of them. the last 1 had to put down cause he was to badly messed up from the beating he took from the lg male.


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## eternity302 (Apr 22, 2010)

alym said:


> Rams have a way of dying more mysteriously than Elvis (who still lives, btw)


 Lets talk about it...
one by one they go missing or dead! And these lil guys aint even cheap~


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## alym (Apr 21, 2010)

eternity302 said:


> Lets talk about it...
> one by one they go missing or dead! And these lil guys aint even cheap~


Yup, Lisa, me, and a few others too all had GBR in our tank, all of which slowly would die off mysteriously...


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## eternity302 (Apr 22, 2010)

I had a few GBR, the Balloon/Short Body GBR, Gold rams, Balloon/Short Body Gold rams, steel blue, sp bienatta or something, 5 cockatoo triple reds, and 3 inca's! All mysteriously die.. i rather wish i spent the money on a cheapy arowana ~.~"


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## rescuepenguin (Apr 21, 2010)

There isn't an option in the poll for me. At the moment my interests are with other fish. I don't have space for them.


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## Marius (Sep 22, 2010)

You don't see many people having them -apistogramma in particular- because they are not schooling fish. That size of a fish one usually keeps to complement others, but with this buggers you build the setup around them, not the other way around. 

Variety wise apistogrammas are your SA version of bettas, with many enthusiasts keeping them. Lots of literature on them as well, they've been studied, classified, re-classified and hunted for (new or more elusive species). As long as you offer them a good environment (plenty of space, right substrate and many, many plants) they can be a very rewarding fish. 

Couldn't vote, and I'd always keep both species, but, again, you build your tank around them 

Enjoy.


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## Kitsune (Jul 17, 2010)

Everyone, Thanks for the input! Very interesting to read everyone's opinion.

We'll see how long my blue rams last in my current tank, and then I'll decide what to do. 

Anyone successful with breeding them?


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## Marius (Sep 22, 2010)

Kitsune said:


> Everyone, Thanks for the input! Very interesting to read everyone's opinion.
> 
> We'll see how long my blue rams last in my current tank, and then I'll decide what to do.
> 
> Anyone successful with breeding them?


Not sure if Rob (Vancouverbetta) is still around. He had done some line breeding on the blue rams with some spectacular results.

As soon as you see a pair form, remove the rest, I presume you have them in a smallish tank? They'll do the deed afterwards, no worries.


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## target (Apr 21, 2010)

Didn't vote as I have never tried apistos. I have 3 rams in my discus tank. They have grown alot and seem really healthy. Not as brightly colored as some I have seen, but lots of personality. They have each staked out a small area as theirs and its fun to watch them chase each other out of their area. I think I have one male and 2 females. I will get a few more when the 90g gets set up.


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## SophieThomas (May 12, 2010)

We keep apistogrammas and I agree that as long as you are aware of the necessary water chemistry for the species, you should be fine. GH and KH have to be quite low. 

I have read that the use of aquarium salt with them can be very detrimental. Perhaps someone can clarify that?


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