# crs die off, is it normal or am I doing something wrong



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

So, I bought a tank setup from a member recently. 

its only been about a week and I noticed some die off, around 4 or 5 crs. say 1 every couple of days.

I suspected it died during a moulting process, but could I be doing something wrong?


----------



## djamm (Sep 25, 2010)

At this time of year...Possibly temperature. 20- 24°C

They like a nice cool location. And any changes need to be a subtle and gentle as possible.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

actually, I ve recounted and lost about 13 shrimps =S 

and I have no heater in the tank so it should be somewhat cool. 
and their located in the washroom too.


----------



## DR1V3N (Apr 22, 2010)

Do you have a TDS Meter or hardness tester? Better yet, you might get more detailed suggestions if you post all of your water parameters.

For future reference, when buying CRS it's best to test (or know) the water of the original keeper. This way you can do your best to match it ahead of time. This is particularly important for older/larger shrimp as they experience more difficulties adapting to new conditions then younger shrimp.

The main parameters that you want to match are pH, hardness and temp. These are the most important to keep stable, assuming ammonia and nitrite not being a problem.


----------



## effox (Apr 21, 2010)

My casualties were due to radical temperature swings throughout the day\night.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

DR1V3N said:


> Do you have a TDS Meter or hardness tester? Better yet, you might get more detailed suggestions if you post all of your water parameters.
> 
> For future reference, when buying CRS it's best to test (or know) the water of the original keeper. This way you can do your best to match it ahead of time. This is particularly important for older/larger shrimp as they experience more difficulties adapting to new conditions then younger shrimp.
> 
> The main parameters that you want to match are pH, hardness and temp. These are the most important to keep stable, assuming ammonia and nitrite not being a problem.


tds was around 195 and now its 120 ish as I did a waterchange too big and it went down quite a bit. but no die off because of it. it was till this few days shrimps have been dieing randomly. I think it may be the temperature swing.

I recounted and theres actually only 4 or 5 loss still. some were hiding i guess. phew..


----------



## waynet (Apr 22, 2010)

I don't think it is totally related to temperature. I think the water composition in the Summer Time is slightly different than water in the Winter time. I basically have constant temperature and I still see a few die off in the Summer. Next year I am going to get a big pail of water before the Summer Months and use that water for water change.


----------



## DR1V3N (Apr 22, 2010)

BaoBeiZhu said:


> tds was around 195 and now its 120 ish as I did a waterchange too big and it went down quite a bit. but no die off because of it. it was till this few days shrimps have been dieing randomly. I think it may be the temperature swing.
> 
> I recounted and theres actually only 4 or 5 loss still. some were hiding i guess. phew..


Haha, it's always good to find some that you thought you lost! I find shrimplets in my canister filter all the time.

Umm, that might be your issue. Try not to do huge water changes (if you feed proper amounts water change is not even necessary). 10% a week is good. Some breeders even use 1 day aged water or rain water to top up the tank.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

DR1V3N said:


> Haha, it's always good to find some that you thought you lost! I find shrimplets in my canister filter all the time.
> 
> Umm, that might be your issue. Try not to do huge water changes (if you feed proper amounts water change is not even necessary). 10% a week is good. Some breeders even use 1 day aged water or rain water to top up the tank.


It is, I felt relieved. I was told to keep the tds around 190?

I dont do big WC, I rescaped the tank that day. so all the jave moss inside the tank i pulled out literally drained the tank to half.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

not sure whats happening again.. 5 die off just over night =(


----------



## gklaw (May 31, 2010)

Haha. Sounds like you need to get busy rather than just counting shrimps. Hope one day you have so many that you can no longer count them every day


----------



## jiang604 (Apr 21, 2010)

Did the seller tell you what their TDS was based on? meaning which benchmark did they go up from and what did they use to get it to that point. More importantly, what is your setup?


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

gklaw said:


> Haha. Sounds like you need to get busy rather than just counting shrimps. Hope one day you have so many that you can no longer count them every day


haha.. one day.. one day.. LOL



jiang604 said:


> Did the seller tell you what their TDS was based on? meaning which benchmark did they go up from and what did they use to get it to that point. More importantly, what is your setup?


it was around 190 and I dropped it to 120 because the tank was transferred with half the water.
but I found out what my problem is.. my ph is WAY too high at 7.6

so I bought PH down and am lowering it every 5 hours. 
hopefully this will save my shrimps

Will keep the thread updated !

Thanks


----------



## neven (May 15, 2010)

if you can, try a bag of peat in your tank and an almond leaf, should lower your PH in a more stable way than adding ph down every 5 hours. You can still ph down during water changes if you still need to, but using it directly on the tank can cause more deaths


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

yeah I ve noticed two deaths so far using the product.

where could I buy almond leaf?

an update.. my gf said that one just moulted.. so it wasnt moving much and I thought it was going to die.. so I threw it in the sink........... omg..


----------



## gsneufeld (Jan 28, 2012)

Hey, I haven't kept crs but when I first started keeping freshwater shrimp about 6 months ago, I did have trouble keeping them healthy/breeding them. After water change day, they would be healthy and perky then during t he week they would get sluggish and weak looking. I eventually figured out that this was due to PH swings, and corrected it, and since then I always have shrimplets and saddled females, and everybodys always digging in the sand or swimming and munching on algae.

I see you mention using PH down. *Don't do that* PH used to be though to be all important, but recent studies show that while an exact ph is important for breeding most fish, for regular maintenence what matters is a *steady* *consistent* ph. The easiest way to do this is by adding minerals like salts and calcium to the water. Even though crs are soft water, most of us here in BC have VERY VERY soft water 
(because we get our water from resevoirs, not aquifers which have rocks constantly eroding into the water)

I've heard that the best thing to do is add a mixture of african cichlid salt and regular baking soda when you're mixing your water with dechlorinator. I just use plain baking soda though and that works fine. Again crs are soft water shrimp, but our water here is like 1 degree hardness.. "Soft" water is considered 5-10 degrees. To prevent PH swings always have a KH of at least 5 degrees.

I have read a lot of debate on the internet as to whether or not the shrimp need added iodine, but I finally settled on yes, reading the FAQ on wetwebmedia freshwater shrimp it seems that the iodine makes moulting problems a thing of the past. I add a tiny bit every second water change, and I have never had a single shrimp death so far *touch wood*


----------



## neven (May 15, 2010)

a kh of 5 degrees works fine with a co2 injected tank, but with a non co2 fish tank, i found 2 KH to work great. Our water may be soft, but our PH jumps too high when buffering to 5 KH without some form of Acid to reduce the PH (in co2 injected = carbonic acid). Consistency is indeed important, but so is matching some parameters of where the inhabitants were bred from. With most shrimp, you will see 6.0-6.8 PH as the normal breeding tank parameters. If you want to adjust parameters to something significantly higher, best to do it over generations of shrimp.


----------



## gsneufeld (Jan 28, 2012)

I agree... I said PH consistency is mostly the only thing that matters except when it comes to breeding (ie keeping a colony of expensive shrimp going). As for adjusting PH, it's not that complicated, you just have to raise it slightly with each partial water change.



neven said:


> a kh of 5 degrees works fine with a co2 injected tank, but with a non co2 fish tank, i found 2 KH to work great. Our water may be soft, but our PH jumps too high when buffering to 5 KH without some form of Acid to reduce the PH (in co2 injected = carbonic acid). Consistency is indeed important, but so is matching some parameters of where the inhabitants were bred from. With most shrimp, you will see 6.0-6.8 PH as the normal breeding tank parameters. If you want to adjust parameters to something significantly higher, best to do it over generations of shrimp.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

a little update, my crs were fine for the past few weeks. but till past few days I started using more co2, and I realized my shrimps started dieing..
so far 5 past away =( leaving me with 8..
but hey one is prego though! so must be a good sign?


----------



## waynet (Apr 22, 2010)

Hi:

Is it a new tank? I would not raise crs if the tank has not been cycled for at least 3-4 months. Keep the parameters constant. My parameters: tds 180, pH = 6.6-6.7. GH = 6-7, temperature 74F. 

I hope they start to breed again. I see many females are berried.

I would have a heater to prevent temperature swing too much.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

the female has dropped all her eggs, and atm i dont run a heater. as i thought room temperature was good enough.. maybe i ll plug on the 50 watt heater now.

and its a 3 months old tank.

my tds is around 110 is that too clean?



waynet said:


> Hi:
> 
> Is it a new tank? I would not raise crs if the tank has not been cycled for at least 3-4 months. Keep the parameters constant. My parameters: tds 180, pH = 6.6-6.7. GH = 6-7, temperature 74F.
> 
> ...


----------



## jiang604 (Apr 21, 2010)

how colds your room? don't get too caught up with TDS. Also first time berrying and dropping isn't uncommon.



BaoBeiZhu said:


> the female has dropped all her eggs, and atm i dont run a heater. as i thought room temperature was good enough.. maybe i ll plug on the 50 watt heater now.
> 
> and its a 3 months old tank.
> 
> my tds is around 110 is that too clean?


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

jiang604 said:


> how colds your room? don't get too caught up with TDS. Also first time berrying and dropping isn't uncommon.


room is usually around 24-25 degrees.

and when can I get the PFRS from you !! lol


----------



## jiang604 (Apr 21, 2010)

BaoBeiZhu said:


> room is usually around 24-25 degrees.
> 
> and when can I get the PFRS from you !! lol


That temps perfectly fine. I wouldn't mess around with it too much.


----------



## BaoBeiZhu (Apr 24, 2010)

jiang604 said:


> That temps perfectly fine. I wouldn't mess around with it too much.


got it .


----------

