# Your opinion on 24 hr non stop co2



## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Has anyone tried to turn on your co2 and airpump 24 hours non stop in order to keep a constant concentration of O2 and CO2 in your water column (Co2 is usually lower int he early morning before it reaches saturation) plus to keep the Ph consistent between night and day (no big Ph swing)?
I have tried to do this for 2 days now and my Ph is the same night and day. I check it about 3-4 times a day and also several times at night. My Co2 drop checker is always lime green so I am sure the airstone is not taking away my Co2 to the point of not giving enough to my plants. My fish are not gasping for air or act liek they are in a coma so i suppose they are getting enough oxygen?
I also change my water 30% every morning. I add alkaline buffer and equilibrium and ferts (EI) and my Kh and Gh is the same every day as well. My water is soft and my Kh is only 3. I add buffer every morning to avoid a crush. My GH is around 3.
What do you think about this?
Thank you.


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## kelownaguy (Jan 1, 2011)

If you are changing 30% every day you certainly do not have a constant concentration of either co2 or O2.

I leave the co2 on 24/7 w/a pH controller in charge.


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## Nicklfire (Apr 21, 2010)

Ive never done it but i dont change something that aint broken.

Ei is not the type of dosing which you can achieve if you change water daily. Ei is to suppky your plants just in excess of needes nutrients then at the end of the week do a 50 percent water change to reset values. Each time you dose the kno3 or trace you are upping the ppm value but if your doing daily water changes then you are probably way under the desired ppm of nutrients if you are going by a normal ei scheduale. I guess it cones down to are your plants growing well..... yes or no.. then there lies your answer


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

i leave my co2 on 24/7 at a lower BPS, during the night the co2 concentration builds up a little bit, then during the day it will dip a bit, but because of the constant supply, the rate in which it dips is quite reduced


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## trout (Mar 21, 2012)

if you have sufficient surface agitation or using an airstone, theres no reason you shouldn't be able to run it 24/7 unless it's bothering your fish. granted you will use almost twice as much CO2....even if using a lower bps its still using more. why the daily WC? your wasting the concentration of the CO2 your getting leaving it on a night if your doing 30% WC every morning? 

but each tank is different so hey if it works dont fix it.


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## davej (Apr 28, 2010)

Running CO2 at night is a waste. Once the lights go out your plants stop using it. If you shut it off when the lights go out it will last twice as long.
I never had problems with large swings when I did it this way. If you are using an air stone during the day with the CO2 there is a good chance that you are off gassing the CO2 at a fairly good rate. It could be the fact that the Co2 concentration never gets all that high to begin with. 
As well if you are dosing EI you only want to do the 50% change once a week. If you get things right and have the right lighting your growth will be phenomenal.

Here is an example of EI with CO2 injection

Sept 11









Oct 25


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Well, thank you for all the response. I am just trying things out to see if I could hold my Ph and also avoid the low Co2 in the morning and the catching up before it reaches 33ppm or so.
I have heard so many people telling me using an air stone would get the Co2 out but the fact is once I use my airstone running non stop, I get a lime green color and my plants are pearling like never bfore--with less Co2 bps then before. That is a fact.
I also do not have to play catch up n the morning and my Co2 is much more constant.
I know plants dont need Co2 at night but it helps to regulate my PH with their presence.
Co2 is cheap and I dont think I am using twice as much as before as I am actulaly injecting less now than before per second, and I get a much higher concentration of Co2 in the beginning of the day now. I know I am injecting more but by how much I am not sure. If I am injecting a bit more but getting much better result is that called a waste? I am not sure.
I understand EI is about dosing a bit more than your plants need to make sure they have enough and a water change of 50% weekly is recommended to remove the excess. But why cant one take away the excess and reset the water parameter daily? I cannot understand why doing it more frenquently than weekly s not EI?
What I do is I change 15% of water in the morning when I mix NPK Micro Fe Equilibrium Alkaline buffer with my new water. Then I change 15% at night after light out but I only add a tiny bit of equilibrium (the amount that is taken out). I add prime both times. 
The night time water change allows me to take out left over food, dead leaves...and to help off set the excess fert after they have been absorbed by the plants for a day. 
Morning time water change allows me to dos my fert and reset my water to the correct ph, kh, and gh before photoperiod starts.
I am not sure if it is a good idea, just want to hear what you guys think...
If I dont run my airstone I am worried it might gas my fish especially at night. I have a feeling the O2/Co2 ratio sort of just regulate themselves because as I sad I am using less Co2 but getting more pearling.
Another thing is I could be wrong but I alwasy feel that the inconsistent amount fo Co2 in the morning when playing catch up is a big cause of algae and now I am using less light (thanks Neven), less Co2, and have mor epearling. Too early to say if it helps with algae though.
Dave J, thanks for the pictures. I do underdtand Co2 and ferts help with plant growth. Your background plants are growing very fast as should be expected. The challenge is always the carpet and foreground such as the kind you have on the left edge of your tank, dont you think? I cannot see them very well, are they glosso or hc? In my opinion, they are the ones that really need a good balance of Co2, ferts and light to get a nice algae free spread. Did you take them out or something as they do nto seem to have spread much after 44 days? Love your downai by the way.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

the main reason i am on 24/7 pressurized was because my solenoid was leaking. But i had great success on diy co2 before pressurized so i knew it would work. if your main goal is to just have enough co2 for lights on, then just drop the airstone and turn the co2 on an hour to hour and a half before lights on, run the co2 for 6 hours, then turn it off. Most plants only use co2 for 4-6 hours of a light cycle. The airstone breaks the water surface causing a lot more offgassing than necessary. if you were worried about oxygen level, you can just add a powerhead to the tank pointing on an angle towards the surface (if you cant with your regular filter). If the surface is moving quite a bit, with water rolling but no bubbles from it, then you have it perfect. No way oxygen will deplete with that flow. As said before, the use of co2 will be drastically different. One of the reasons im on 24/7 still is because its only running two 9.8 gallons on co2, the other tank was already taken apart


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## Reckon (Jul 25, 2012)

I second this, why not use a ph controller? I'm still new at this but, this allows you to dose until and maintain desired c02/ph levels?

Milwaukee pH Controller & Monitor MC122



kelownaguy said:


> I leave the co2 on 24/7 w/a pH controller in charge.


Holy smokes, I admire your dedication to your tank. That is a lot of work on a daily basis. I already hate doing water changes every 4 days or so, especially with 2 tanks.



Fish rookie said:


> What I do is I change 15% of water in the morning when I mix NPK Micro Fe Equilibrium Alkaline buffer with my new water. Then I change 15% at night after light out but I only add a tiny bit of equilibrium (the amount that is taken out). I add prime both times.


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

If your tank is doing fine than dont do anything. I think to most of us working on your tank twice a day is tons of work. I do have my hands in some of my tanks everyday but performing water changes everyday. Now thats dedication!!!

If you do feel like changing things up than a Ph controller would be good. Or why not run the airpump on a timer and run it only when the lights are off. At night is where the issues can occur since plants take in oxygen at night so they will be competing with the fish for air. It will also help with PH swings.


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## davej (Apr 28, 2010)

If you do decide to go with a ph controller send me a PM.
I have an American Marine one I could give you a good deal on.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Thanks a lot.
I will try to run my air pump at night on a timer and my Co2 only when light is on for a while to see.
I have decreased my ligth by quite a bit but with higher Co2 alage is under control and the plants seem fine. I will try the suggestions offered here and see how it goes. Thanks everyone.


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## Reckon (Jul 25, 2012)

Sorry, I need clarification. Isn't running the airstone at night a good idea with 24/7 co2? But to turn off co2 at night and run an airstone instead would degas co2 quicker causing an equally quicker ph swing?


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

I read that most plants love a slightly acidic envirnoment so if you have no fish you can just leave your Co2 24/7. People would say you are wasting your Co2 at night but it does help to keep the PH low and constant...so I am not sure if you can say it is wasted.
To turn on the airstone is mainly just for the fish from how I understand it. Since most peopel dotn want to waste any Co2 so they only do it at night with Co2 off in order to disslove enought O2 in the water without wasting Co2.
I actually do not really notice a siginificate out gas of my Co2 even with non stop air stone, but my airstone was place on the opposite side of the Co2 and it is located at kind of a dead spot in the corner. I personally feel that the gas exchange would regulate itself so there will be enough of both at all time plus with this set up my pH swing is much much less--but I am willing to try alternative.
I also believe O2 is good for the friendly bacteria and the fish even during the day which is why I left it on.
I have been trimming my plants very often with this method, this is a picture after a recent trim. As you can see, the picture was taken in the middle of the night and the drop checker was green--if I only had my O2 on, with Co2 off, the color will be more like blue. I probably should have trimmed the front carpet a bit more but I was too tried. LOL I was mainly focusing on trimming the background plants(the macrandra was reaching above the water line) so the leaves will get smaller and the plants will look more bushy.
Bottom line as I understand it is...I think... just as injecting Co2 into the tank during the day when plants need them, turning on an air stone can help the plants to get more O2 at nigth when plants need them for respiration. About Ph swing I have read that if Kh and Gh are kept more or less constant Ph swing should nto really harm the fish....so far I have not had any fish died due to a Ph swing...but I am not sure as I am still just a rookie.LOL
I will try the more conventional method and see how it goes...anyway thanks everyone.


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