# 315g update more plants added



## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

Current setup. Added more plants. Soon more fish and more plants pa ulit.








Early pre-planted


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## Chronick (Apr 27, 2010)

nice... i love the micro


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## Hammer (Apr 22, 2010)

You've got monster fish covered


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

Very vanaqua-esque! Looks great. Love how the light comes through the floating wood and plants


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## Ruf R (Jun 11, 2010)

Looks awesome earl


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## AWW (Apr 22, 2010)

Tank looks awesome man. The dollars don't eat the plants?


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

No they dont bother the plants. They would nibble on soft wood sometimes though. I feed them nuts sometimes. If I have severums or vieja/paratheraps, all my plants would be goners. Always wanted to have a super red sevs and red shoulder but they nibble on my anubias.


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## charles (Apr 21, 2010)

El, I think the big wood overpower the tank and take too much space for the fish to swim.


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

I tried to take it out but too heavy for me with all the water it absorb. Also not to scractch the acrylic as well. Wanted to take that out actually.


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## Ruf R (Jun 11, 2010)

Earl come grab the umbee I broke my phone so text me your number again thx.


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## Ruf R (Jun 11, 2010)

Hey earl also I'll take that wood if you don't want it Lol


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

U can have the wood but it does not sink.


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## Rogo (Mar 1, 2015)

Based on how big those fish will be at full-size (and the waste they produce), isn't that tank overstocked? It looks like the fish don't have room to move without bumping into each other.

(not criticizing; just asking)


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

Rogo said:


> Based on how big those fish will be at full-size (and the waste they produce), isn't that tank overstocked? It looks like the fish don't have room to move without bumping into each other.
> 
> (not criticizing; just asking)


All home aquarium are overstock regardless what size. Nobody can match mother nature. We just try as much as possible to keep them healthy.

Dont u have an ornate bichir and a black ghost knife in a 72g tank. Isn't that over stock as well? Just asking.


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## Rogo (Mar 1, 2015)

King-eL said:


> All home aquarium are overstock regardless what size. Nobody can match mother nature. We just try as much as possible to keep them healthy.
> 
> Dont u have an ornate bichir and a black ghost knife in a 72g tank. Isn't that over stock as well? Just asking.


Probably, but they're medium-sized and have enough room to swim without bumping into each other, and there multiple filters running so the waste isn't an issue. I was asking because I've heard that if fish are constantly bumping into each other it causes undue stress (the exception is schooling fish).


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

Rogo said:


> Probably, but they're medium-sized and have enough room to swim without bumping into each other, and there multiple filters running so the waste isn't an issue. I was asking because I've heard that if fish are constantly bumping into each other it causes undue stress (the exception is schooling fish).


Well base on the fish at full size ur 72g tank is still too small regardless if u attached a public size filter. The pheromones that the fish will produce in that small tank will increase faster. Causing ur fish to get stunted and die at an early age. Both fishes can surpass 20"+.

I admit that my tank is over stock thats why I place a large sump enough for the bio-load of the fish I'm keeping. I have tors and silver dollars and they are schooling fish so that makes them an exception as thats what u heard right? Gars do shoal as well even in the wild and as for bichirs, they can sometimes be found piling up on each other in the wild. Always see my fish bumping into each other though as they are trying to breed. Most imported part that I always keep my fish healthy.


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## Rogo (Mar 1, 2015)

King-eL said:


> Well base on the fish at full size ur 72g tank is still too small regardless if u attached a public size filter. The pheromones that the fish will produce in that small tank will increase faster. Causing ur fish to get stunted and die at an early age. Both fishes can surpass 20"+.
> 
> I admit that my tank is over stock thats why I place a large sump enough for the bio-load of the fish I'm keeping. I have tors and silver dollars and they are schooling fish so that makes them an exception as thats what u heard right? Gars do shoal as well even in the wild and as for bichirs, they can sometimes be found piling up on each other in the wild. Always see my fish bumping into each other though as they are trying to breed. *Most imported part that I always keep my fish healthy*.


...and then I saw your response regarding adding dither fish for a Trimac: "Silver dollars are good for dither as they can always handle many poundings from cichlids"

In my opinion, we need to be mindful of the well-being of all the fish in an aquarium, not just the ones we like to show-off. Adding fish simply because they can take a pounding isn't the best advice. I recognize you're a forum-god and I'm a newbie to the site, but I felt obligated to point this out because there are people who come to the site looking for education and guidance, and when they read something like that it's going to lead them down the wrong path and cause them to possibly lose interest with the hobby (really, having your fish constantly fighting or being killed isn't a good way for people to be introduced to a great pass-time).

Again, I'm a newbie and you're a forum god so I need to be respectful of my place, but that advice turned my stomach. You and I obviously have different approaches to animal-husbandry and fish care, so we'll just have to agree to disagree.


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

This is why I rarely post here in bca. Too many forum police. Before u start correcting somebody, learn to correct urself first.

Oh well this tread stops here.


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## Ruf R (Jun 11, 2010)

Hey rogo if what you read made your stomach turn so much why not have a private message with king el instead of derailing his thread??? Just saying lol... but I guess being a newbie that excuses your arrogance.


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## Rogo (Mar 1, 2015)

Ruf R said:


> Hey rogo if what you read made your stomach turn so much why not have a private message with king el instead of derailing his thread??? Just saying lol... but I guess being a newbie that excuses your arrogance.


It's not arrogance, I just feel obligated to speak-out in defense of all living things that deserve to be treated kindly and in a humane way. You may disagree with compassion, and be content to sit idle, and that's your right to do so.

Re-read the thread; El publicly gave advice that I think is detrimental to the well-being of some fish, and which I feel are just as entitled to proper care and humane treatment as specimen fish, so I contradicted his opinion. People should be able to disagree and have differing opinions without being called arrogant.


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

Rogo said:


> It's not arrogance, I just feel obligated to speak-out in defense of all living things that deserve to be treated kindly and in a humane way. You may disagree with compassion, and be content to sit idle, and that's your right to do so.
> 
> Re-read the thread; El publicly gave advice that I think is detrimental to the well-being of some fish, and which I feel are just as entitled to proper care and humane treatment as specimen fish, so I contradicted his opinion. People should be able to disagree and have differing opinions without being called arrogant.


Then why are u placing an ornate bichir and a bgk in a 72g?


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## Rogo (Mar 1, 2015)

King-eL said:


> Then why are u placing an ornate bichir and a bgk in a 72g?


...because I read your advice saying it's okay to overpopulate tanks and let dither fish take a "pounding". You're a forum god and the newbies look to you for guidance and advice. Is the information you're sharing and the way you're populating your tanks not the best thing for fish???


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

Rogo said:


> ...because I read your advice saying it's okay to overpopulate tanks and let dither fish take a "pounding". You're a forum god and the newbies look to you for guidance and advice. Is the information you're sharing and the way you're populating your tanks not the best thing for fish???


Oh I thought you want to treat them in a humane way. Next time correct yourself first before correcting someone. I have some of my bichirs for more than 10-12 years now. I bet that ornate and bgk of yours wont even last 3-5 years in that tank. I wont be surprise if that fish wont pass 16-18" and dies at an early age. Or probably gonna see your fish in FS/FF/FT section soon.


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## Rogo (Mar 1, 2015)

You are correct that a 72 gallon bow-front is too small for a full-grown bichir and BGK, which is why I have a larger aquarium (6' x 2' footprint) for them to be moved to when they outgrow their current enclosure. If they get too big for that I'll get an even larger aquarium. At the size they are at now they have plenty of room to swim around in their 72g without bumping into each other or showing any signs of stress.

If we both agree that bigger fish need more space (which is the humane way to house them), I wish you luck building your in-ground swimming pool to house the mass of fish you have crammed in your 310. I'm being facetious when I say that because you're criticizing me for keeping 4 (you keep forgetting my two Striped Raphael catfish) fish in a 72 gallon while you have dozens in a 310. Your set-up appears to be more for meeting your needs than of the fishes, but that's just my opinion.

When you re-read the thread from the beginning you'll noticed I asked if your tank was overstocked (and even pointed out I wasn't being critical, just asking the question so I could learn from others). You got defensive and started criticizing how I was housing my fish.

In an earlier post you said you were going to end the thread, but haven't, so I'm just going to stop responding. The conversation is getting tiring and proves nothing more than you and I have a different approach to fish-care. You think it's okay for some fish to take a "pounding", and I want all the fish in my care to be happy and healthy. You have your preferences and I have mine, and that's okay.

Best of luck with your fish (they are beautiful!)

Sincerely,
Rogo


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## King-eL (Apr 21, 2010)

Rogo said:


> You are correct that a 72 gallon bow-front is too small for a full-grown bichir and BGK, which is why I have a larger aquarium (6' x 2' footprint) for them to be moved to when they outgrow their current enclosure. If they get too big for that I'll get an even larger aquarium. At the size they are at now they have plenty of room to swim around in their 72g without bumping into each other or showing any signs of stress.
> 
> If we both agree that bigger fish need more space (which is the humane way to house them), I wish you luck building your in-ground swimming pool to house the mass of fish you have crammed in your 310. I'm being facetious when I say that because you're criticizing me for keeping 4 (you keep forgetting my two Striped Raphael catfish) fish in a 72 gallon while you have dozens in a 310. Your set-up appears to be more for meeting your needs than of the fishes, but that's just my opinion.
> 
> ...


I'm glad u got tired as I was waiting for it. Have fun with you supposed to be healthy happy fish. Wish you luck when you have that 6x2 or what ever big tank you're talking about. Knowing how fast ornates grows, hopefully it never eats the bgk.


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## charles (Apr 21, 2010)

Ok, you two. Get a room 

Seriously though, both of you have good points. El, I think Rogo is just concerning about the health of your fish. His 72g is more than comfortable at the moment of the type of fish that he has.

As for you, you know how to do JDM tank. It is one of those that you need to have massive amount of filtration and bio and wc in order to keep it going.

I think both of you should just get to know each other more in private or even over a coffee.  And if you are buying, I will come along


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## jbyoung00008 (May 16, 2011)

300g is a BIG tank. I agree you have a lot of fish in there. The mashers might be overkill but if it's working who's to say it's wrong? I have 40 fish in my 120g and at times I think its over crowded. Im sure others do as well. LOL but I know my system and I know I can keep up with the maintenance. You obviously feel the same about your setup and like me feel you are giving your fish the best life you can. A nice natural lay out  My favorite!

Rogo an over crowded tank is not for new fish keepers. It takes years of fish keeping experience and literally becomes a part time job keeping up with it. Your opinion on others tanks is allowed just expect some people don't want to hear it. 

IMO, At the end of the day. They are just fish. A simple minded creature that we humans have raised and bred for our own enjoyment. You can not compare them to people or animals like a dog or cat. They dont have feelings or emotions. They spend there lives thinking of 3 things. Food, Pick on the weak and breed. Yes. they deserve to be treated with best intentions but lets not forget. They are fish. If they are eating, they are happy and If they arn't, than theres a problem. Bare bottom fish tanks bother me more than crowded tanks but hey thats my opinion. Too many monster fish are sold a LFS and frankly sticking a Silver Arrowana in a 500g is still way too small but people do it anyways. I have had fish for over 25 years. I've flushed more fish than Id like to admit but thats part of the process, Unfortunately!!! Pushing tanks to the limit is fun and addictive. If the intentions are good, and the hobbyist knows what they are doing, than no harm, no foul. Dont get me wrong. I LOVE fish. 

Just my 2 cents. Happy fish keeping.


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