# Filter media



## dwarf_puffer (Apr 25, 2010)

I just purchased a eheim 2260 and im looking to fill it with media. now i cant be spending 15 dollars a box on media because for those who havent seen this filter before its big! so what other cheaper media are people using. i have heard of using pillow cotton for like filter floss kinda thing anyone use this or other cool ideas similar?


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## TCR (Jul 13, 2010)

pot scrubbers as bio media


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## hgi (Jun 13, 2010)

I've tried using those cheap pot scrubbers in my fx5 and it was just a wast of money, pot scrubbers do NOT work in canisters, they work best for tickle filter set ups, even though plastic bio balls are cheap as it is.

Back on topic,

Bottom line is this,

What you pay for is what you get.


You spent the money to get the eheim 2260 so why cheap out on the most important part of it? I managed to put maybe 20 boxes of those $15 a box filter media (bio max) into my fx5, all I did was picked up 3 or 4 boxes every payday (every two weeks) until my filter was full. Sure it took a while to get done but trust me, don't cheap out on the most important part of the filter.


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## TCR (Jul 13, 2010)

well online is also cheaper


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## discuspaul (Jul 2, 2010)

*Filter Floss*

Polyester batting (just like filter floss, only better & much cheaper) is available at fabric discount stores - like Fabricland - 1 full yard for about $5.- no harmful chemicals - thicker - works like a charm - try it ! Just cut it to size to fit your filter - double it up - 2 layers. Throw it out after a week or two & replace it.


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

What size of a tank do ypou have and what's the bioload? You don't have to fill up the whole filter at once.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

I would not use poly batting for a filter like the 2260, it would get clogged in no time. I would get and get a bunch of bunch filtration mats (I saw them in big sheets at J&L and I'm sure other LFS will sell them too) or else you'll be cleaning your every week.

For bio in my FX5 I use a combination of Ehfisubstrat Pro, Seachem Matrix, and one tray of plastic pot scrubbers. I personally like how the scrubbers work and how porous and easy to clean they are, but I don't like the weight. You can buy Seachem Matrix in bulk. 2 L for $18 doesn't seem bad at J&L SeaChem Matrix - 2 Litre So for $40 you'd have 4L of it.


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## hp10BII (Apr 23, 2010)

If you want to DIY, I think plastic toy soldiers would be cool.

Bio Filter Media for Ponds and Koi

Otherwise, I really like Seachem Matrix - cheaper than Eheim biological media


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## chillin (Apr 21, 2010)

you could try purigen by seahem,alittle more expensive but works great,a little goes a long way,then a good mechanical filter,foam;bioballs, etc;to fill the rest of the filter,works great on all my tanks ..chillin


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

Remember that the best bio filteration often requires the most cleaning, ceramics will clog in no time.

If you use a coarse sponge prefilter on your intake strainer, you'll be able to maintain a decent flow rate on and reduce the need for cannister maintenance, just squeeze the sponge a few times with water you removed form the tank every water change (pretty easy to do)

You can then use some medium sponge and even some cotton closest to the intake, the cotton will polish the water for you.

Filling the rest of the cannister with pot scrubbers will give you more than sufficient bio filteration. biomax is overkill imo, if you got the money to waste go for it.

heres a chart i found comparing the surface area. you'll notice most of the commercial bio products are below the surface area of the potscrubbers.


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## dwarf_puffer (Apr 25, 2010)

tony1928 said:


> What size of a tank do ypou have and what's the bioload? You don't have to fill up the whole filter at once.


its a 6 foot heavily planted tank. its a community and the bio load is i woul say moderately high? im also running a fluval 304 on the tank aswell.


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## hgi (Jun 13, 2010)

neven I'm guessing your speaking from experiences right since canister filter on your 29g tank must be full of pot scrubbers.


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## Rayne (Jul 12, 2010)

neven said:


> heres a chart i found comparing the surface area. you'll notice most of the commercial bio products are below the surface area of the potscrubbers.


Where would the Eheim Substrat Pro fall on that list?


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

I have an xp1, so im limited on space. What i've had before was these plastic wheel spoke thingies from king ed, i couldn't fit many in and reading into them their surface area just sucked, so i tossed them for some pot scrubbers. Im in the process of replacing most of my media with the pot scrubbers, but im taking it slow to not upset the bacteria colony in my filter.

My current set up is:
Intake - Fluval Edge Prefilter sponge

then from bottom to top as with rena its how it works
30 ppi open cell foam
20 ppo open cell foam
bag of crushed coral/pot scrubbers
filter floss with a polishing pad.

as monday is my filter maintnence day, i'll be removing the 30 ppi open cell and using more pot scrubbers, as its not really needed considering my prefilter is a finer grade foam, in a month i'll remove some of the filter floss again and use more pot scrubbers, after that the polisher pad to see if i see any clarity issues. the 20 ppi pad will stay on the bottom of my filter to act as the mechanical filteration with my prefilter.

I dont have issues with water quality in my tank, all but one of my driftwood have been in the tank a very long time so the rate of tannins leeching into the water column is slow enough i see no discolouration. No odour aswell, so i have no need to run carbon and purigen on a planted tank seems pointless to me.

Also i'm not a fan of over stocking tanks my tanks, Fishies need their room to swim, no matter how much you up the bio media and o2 that part wont change. A little over is fine though if you plan your species well enough, ie, top swimmers, middle and bottom.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

Rayne said:


> Where would the Eheim Substrat Pro fall on that list?


the list excludes expensive stuff, but it doesn't clog nearly as much as the rest of the expensive media does (cindered ceramics for example)

as for its comparison, i found this on another forum:

Ehfisubstrat/ehfisubstrat pro = 18,300 sq. ft. per gallon.
Pot scrubbers = 2767.6 sq. ft per gallon

1 cubic foot = 7.48 gallons of water.

massive difference, but take into account what your tank is going to be used for before you drop spend your money on something like this.

Sponges for the most part were the standard for bio for a long time, and most average sized tanks could get by with sponge/filterfloss media only, they successfully kept an aquarium, with clear water Most of us never see any difference in the tank, or by water param readings between many of the cheap solutions vs the expensive. These are bio media afterall, mechanical is what removes the debris. You see the uses of these high end media only when you enter the extremes of the hobby, severely overstocked discus tanks, monster fish keepers for example will be suited for this media, even then many still use cheap solutions like pot scrubbers. For us with regular stocked or a bit overstocked tanks, planted tanks and whatnot, we don't need insane surface area to house our bio filtration we'll be establishing


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

This is a good discussion. I recently just got a xp2. I have two trays. And the layers are as follows:
Tray 1:
-30ppi foam
-20ppi foam
-divider
-9 bio-stars
-bag of clarity (sorb-something) --carbon **will not replace it when I maintain it in a months time
-two small bags of crush coral

Tray 2:
-1.25litres of seachem matrix
-Divider
-polishing pad

I was actually planning to put a pre-filter like a fluval edge sponge (but didn't know whether it'll fit or not) does it fit?
Same setup as neven...almost.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

it fits but its tight (not a bad thing), you also got to squeeze it out every water change. If you dont than about 10-12 days it collapses against the strainer yellin at you IDIOT YOU SHOULD HAVE CLEANED ME! and give you maintenance on an unplanned date. A coarse sponge will allow you to probably get to every two weeks possibly more, either of them atleast prevent suprise fry and baby shrimpies from gettign sucked in atleast


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## Kitsune (Jul 17, 2010)

neven, sounds like you've done a lot of research on this topic!

dwarf_puffer, the alternative would be to use the cheap pot scrubbers for now and monitor your nitrate/nitrite/ammonia on a daily (or weekly, biweekly...) basis for a month and decide what level you are comfortable with. If you need to do a water change once a week and you decide that's too often then you can look into replacing the media 10% at a time (i.e. don't replace the the entire thing... that can be costly, do it in steps) until you reach happy a medium, which may mean you only need 50% of the good stuff... Does that make sense? It's not like it has to be 100% pot scrubber OR 100% expensive bio media... That's the nice thing about canister filters, you get to mix 'n match.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

im a google addict


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## ngo911 (May 19, 2010)

Kitsune said:


> neven, sounds like you've done a lot of research on this topic!
> 
> dwarf_puffer, the alternative would be to use the cheap pot scrubbers for now and monitor your nitrate/nitrite/ammonia on a daily (or weekly, biweekly...) basis for a month and decide what level you are comfortable with. If you need to do a water change once a week and you decide that's too often then you can look into replacing the media 10% at a time (i.e. don't replace the the entire thing... that can be costly, do it in steps) until you reach happy a medium, which may mean you only need 50% of the good stuff... Does that make sense? It's not like it has to be 100% pot scrubber OR 100% expensive bio media... That's the nice thing about canister filters, you get to mix 'n match.


How would replacing potscrubbers with commercial bio media allow you to change your water less often? If it does, I would gladly switch but I don't understand how it would.


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## Mferko (Jun 8, 2010)

neven said:


> the list excludes expensive stuff, but it doesn't clog nearly as much as the rest of the expensive media does (cindered ceramics for example)
> 
> as for its comparison, i found this on another forum:
> 
> ...


i agree with that 100%, you should only worry about having the best biofiltration if you have a big bioload.

the difference is massive tho and from what ive read online this cintered glass that its made of is inert will pretty much last forever, you just need to rinse them off every now and then.
you dont need to replace them as much as the manufacturer suggests, only if they break/crumble

maybe if your cannister filter has enough media baskets you can fill it with pot scrubbers initially and then start filling the baskets with the ehfisubstrat pro only if you feel you need more biofiltration...
but it definately seems worth the money in the long run unless you have a heavily planted tank that takes care of alot of your nitrogenous wastes for you.


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## hp10BII (Apr 23, 2010)

One of the reasons I prefer Seachem Matrix over Eheim Substrat Pro is not only the cost (I have 4 litres of Substrat Pro NIB), but it's anti clogging properties. Though I'm not sure about it's claim of removing Nitrates, I've never been disappointed with Seachme products. As good as Eheim media is, the pores are fine and subject to clogging with organic waste. That would take away a good portion of it's bio capacity. IIRC, Eheim suggests rotating the media out gradually every 6 months. The media is still in great shape, a soaking in bleach will unclog the pores and it will be good to go.

With Matrix, a good swish in used tank water and back into the canister it goes.

Seachem. Matrix


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## discuspaul (Jul 2, 2010)

*message for 2wheelssx2 - re: ilter media*



2wheelsx2 said:


> I would not use poly batting for a filter like the 2260, it would get clogged in no time. I would get and get a bunch of bunch filtration mats (I saw them in big sheets at J&L and I'm sure other LFS will sell them too) or else you'll be cleaning your every week.
> 
> For bio in my FX5 I use a combination of Ehfisubstrat Pro, Seachem Matrix, and one tray of plastic pot scrubbers. I personally like how the scrubbers work and how porous and easy to clean they are, but I don't like the weight. You can buy Seachem Matrix in bulk. 2 L for $18 doesn't seem bad at J&L SeaChem Matrix - 2 Litre So for $40 you'd have 4L of it.


2 wheels:
Why, please tell me why, i.e. the specific reasons, you would not use batting in any filter ? I've never known it to clog up. Not being sarcastic = perhaps you know something I don't know.
I've kept many tanks over 40 + years, and have used batting in several filters over extended periods of time. Have been using it consistently in my discus tank for many months with excellent results - crystal clear water at all times -It gets very dirty quickly- which to me is a sign of it's effectiveness. I change it weekly & it does a great job (with a little help from Purigen).
Are you blowing some hot air with this post ?


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

emile said:


> 2 wheels:
> Why, please tell me why, i.e. the specific reasons, you would not use batting in any filter ? I've never known it to clog up. Not being sarcastic = perhaps you know something I don't know.
> I've kept many tanks over 40 + years, and have used batting in several filters over extended periods of time. Have been using it consistently in my discus tank for many months with excellent results - crystal clear water at all times -It gets very dirty quickly- which to me is a sign of it's effectiveness. I change it weekly & it does a great job (with a little help from Purigen).
> Are you blowing some hot air with this post ?


First you say you're not being sarcastic and then you ask me if I'm blowing hot air? No sarcasm there. 

Ask anyone with fluid mechanics experience. Buy yourself a filter that's rated for 950 GPH without media, and then stuff if full of batting that will trap fine dirt. What happens then? You're essentially curtailing the flow. If you want to do that, use a smaller filter. I use batting, all the time. I use it in my 204 and I use it in my Eheim 2213. I don't use it in my XP3, FX5, 2028, nor will I use it in my 2078.

That's like taking your 400 HP mustang GT and then putting a potato in the exhaust. Wonder where all the HP went?

Ask Tony1928 or anyone else who's used an FX5 (do you own one, or high flow filter like the 2260?). Putting in microfiltration media means cleaning the filter every week to maintain flow. I have a microfiltration pad in my XP3 that I'm about to throw out for that very reason.

Read paragraph 5 on this FX5 link: The Fluval Fx5 by Hagen

There, all my hot air is gone.


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## tony1928 (Apr 22, 2010)

Emile, go buy yourself a nice set of FX5 fine polishing pads and see how long you get good flow out of the filter. I had a 135g tank with my SA cichlids going for a while, and I kid you not, that the pads did a wonderful job polishing the water, but they almost, pretty darn close to brought flow down to nothing. I was shocked. I put my hand over the outflow and there was no noticeable flow. Thought the FX5 died. Then I took the top off and the filter pad was completely filled with detritus. Did its job as designed, but man, I'll never do that again. I can't be servicing pads every week or two on an FX5. The pads are round and a perfect fit inside the basket. I guess for those that think there's too much bypass on an FX5. I can assure you that there isn't much. LOL.


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## Kitsune (Jul 17, 2010)

ngo911 said:


> How would replacing potscrubbers with commercial bio media allow you to change your water less often? If it does, I would gladly switch but I don't understand how it would.


I think there are two conversations happening on this thread which is making things confusing! 

There are, as far as I can think of, three different purposes that filters have:
1. Mechanical Filtration: removing large particles (detritus, left over fish food, etc). This includes macro and micro particles (the macro will be chunks that can be removed with sponge/foam, micro would be particles that are removed by carbon)
2. Biological filtration: this is where the good bugs come into play to help with the ammonia cycle
3. Chemical filtration: Altering the chemistry of the tank, including removing ammonia (w/o the use of bugs), crushed coral, peat etc.

I think our discussion is focusing mostly on the biological filtration. Now when we are talking about the surface area/volume of the media (which neven found a wonderful table for) tells you how much surface area that the bugs have to attach to. The more area you have the more bugs. And this is where the expensive media comes into play. The higher the area to volume ratio, the more bugs, and higher the efficiency (now Carbon does work as biological filtration, and it looks like it has a very high ratio, HOWEVER the pores get clogged up fast, so you lose the ratio quickly). BUT the problem is that some of these media will get clogged with dead bacteria rather fast. Some of the media (like the sponge or the plastics) you can wash/squeeze and get it back to its 'original' condition, others will not be as easy (I'm going to say the ceramic ones with out any basis for it). If you have a low bioload for your filter than you might not ever need to clean/replace the media because there is still enough surface area left on it to be sustainable.

So when we are talking about pads/sponges/batts getting 'dirty/clogged' really fast we have to recognize whether its due to mechanical (coarse to fine particles) or biological filtration (bacteria).

So back to this discussion about pot scrubbers, the point is can you get enough bacteria to grow on it to deal with your bio load (i.e. the ammonia cycle)? And if so how often would you have to clean it to keep it going... I don't have a clue how often you would have to clean pot scrubbers...

If a pot scrubber doesn't have enough surface area to maintain your bio load, you need to either upgrade the canister, or put higher efficiency stuff (i.e. higher surface area to volume) in.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

It's really simple. Your tank is a closed system, so unless you have a net consumer of nitrogenous wastes (like plants in a freshwater tank, or some sort of Ammo-zorb type stuff), the wastes keep building up, no matter how many filters you have. The role of the bio bed is to convert ammonia and nitrite to the least toxic form which is nitrates. But you still have to transport the nitrate out to keep it at a tolerable level (many say max of 30- 50 ppm for most fish). That's the bottom line.

In a planted, you can get away with no water changes if your fish load is light as you can balance uptake and output. In a high tech tank, the uptake is too high and you actually have to dose nitrates to feed the plants (all my tanks are this way).

Hopefully, I didn't confuse things further.


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## dwarf_puffer (Apr 25, 2010)

2wheelsx2 said:


> It's really simple. Your tank is a closed system, so unless you have a net consumer of nitrogenous wastes (like plants in a freshwater tank, or some sort of Ammo-zorb type stuff), the wastes keep building up, no matter how many filters you have. The role of the bio bed is to convert ammonia and nitrite to the least toxic form which is nitrates. But you still have to transport the nitrate out to keep it at a tolerable level (many say max of 30- 50 ppm for most fish). That's the bottom line.
> 
> In a planted, you can get away with no water changes if your fish load is light as you can balance uptake and output. In a high tech tank, the uptake is too high and you actually have to dose nitrates to feed the plants (all my tanks are this way).
> 
> Hopefully, I didn't confuse things further.


thanks everyone it took me a while to read but this did give me a lot of good information my tank is pretty heavily planted which i suppose is a good thing now  but the only other question i have is what classifies a tank to be a high tech aquarium?


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

High lights, bulk ferts, CO2, specialized substrate => high tech.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

Generally speaking, High tech = Co2 injected, often times with a PH controller, High light (4w/g +), high dosing regime, and a nutrient rich substrate

Thats like low end high tech. You can also go with Lighting controllers, Automatic water changing, peristaltic pumps to dose all your fertilizers, and theres probably even more gadgets i just cant think of


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## dwarf_puffer (Apr 25, 2010)

thanks so much everyone my only other question is doe any of that media raise or lower the pH i need to be keeping my Ph lower since its a discus tank and i know that coral raises it but does any of the other media raise it aswell ?


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## dwarf_puffer (Apr 25, 2010)

sorry i double posted by mistake...... but if to add to my other one if there is any media that lowers Ph please let me know aswell (other than peat)


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## jobber (May 14, 2010)

You can use driftwood or almond leaves to help lower pH.


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## 2wheelsx2 (Apr 21, 2010)

Driftwood, as said above, or you can filter your water through peat. But really, I'd stay away from altering pH, as that requires more fiddling. And what happens during a water change? Your fish will experience a pH spike.


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## neven (May 15, 2010)

i take it you are likely on the well water grids in langely?

Your only real option to maintain a lower PH without much swing is to do the above to get your water in the tank to where you want it.

Water changes are your downfall, it buffers up there, the water, so you'll need to mix tap water with R/O water to get to where your tank will be. Which means you'll need to buy an R/O unit for your home.


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## dwarf_puffer (Apr 25, 2010)

ok i actually have an R/O unit upstairs so ill start using it. but other than that none of the ehiem or seachem products are going to raise the PH none are like coral?


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