# Total rookie questions



## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Okay, so I decided to turn a 45 gallon into a fowlr tank.
I put in some live rocks, some dead rocks, some crushed coral substrates.
Mixed up some Intsant Ocean, got salinity to about 1.023-1.025
I added some stability and I have 2 maxijet 1200, but I am not sure is that way too much current?
How do you place the wavemakers in a tank to get best result, any general rules?
I have checked and cannot find any dead spot in the tank. I drop some food inside once in a while to feed and try to cycle the tank.
I am using a protein skimmer, and also a HOB.
In the HOB I have a sponge which I rinse daily, a bag of ferrous oxide, and a bag or purigen.
This is meant to be a low budget set up so I am not prepare to buy a sump or a fancy protein skimmer.
I have no idea what I am doing, especially about filtration. Will this work?
Thanks.


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## MEDHBSI (Sep 4, 2011)

2 1200's in a 45 gallon seems a little much to me.So your using the HOB for mechanical filtration only? I usually have one facing up to get some movement on the top of the water helping it keep cool enough in the summer months. Whats your lighting?


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Yes, I just think it would be easier to keep the sponge clean with the HOB because it can be slide out easily (Fluval C4) and I also put a bag of purigen and ferrous oxide to adsorb phosphate and organics. I have read that this type of filter is not recommended for saltwater?
How about if I use a Xp3 and put some sponge and a bunch of live rock inside with some chemi-pure and purigen?
I am thinking of doing about 5-10 gallon water change a week.
Light is just a cheapo coralife with an actinic and a 10000K T5. It is a low budget tank, I just use something I already have.
The placement of the wavemaker you are putting them facing each other with one pointing up and one pointing down?


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

Problem with MJ powerheads is that it sends out a "jet" of water, as opposed to a wide stream of water from a Jebao or Hydor Koralia. 

Call me when you have time and I can talk you through this stuff. If you want, come on the weekend and we'll discuss reefing and throw some meat on the bbq.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Thanks Anthony. 
Well, MaxiJet is cheap which is why I used it.
I promised my wife to stay within a tight budget in exchange for her letting me take a little step over to the dark side. I cannot afford to upset my wife, she has been extremely patient with my fish hobby.
Will the fish have problem swimming in the tank? I am only thinking of very hardy cheap beginner fish for now as I honestly have no idea what I am doing.
I also do not have a water barrel so I will just mix Instant Ocean in a 5 gallon bucket with hot + cold tap with prime then pour it into the tank...
I am not ambitious, just want to have 1 or 2 nemo in the tank, may be with a small school of something, that is all.


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## albert_dao (May 28, 2012)

I noticed you're in Richmond. If you want, feel free to pop by my place and I can show you a SUPER low budget system that I use to propagate and house a few fish to great success.


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

albert_dao said:


> I noticed you're in Richmond. If you want, feel free to pop by my place and I can show you a SUPER low budget system that I use to propagate and house a few fish to great success.


Highly recommend you take up Albert on his generous offer. He knows his sw


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## mrbob (Aug 9, 2012)

shhh...Bright Side...LOL


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

For those who know what they are doing, it is the bright side for sure. A nice saltwater tank is beauty to behold.
For me...I have no glue so I am lost in complete darkness. LOL
I think the current is too strong in my tank. I got a couple cheapo fish to test it out and they keep staying on the bottom corner, top corner and such, never come out and swim in the middle. It is either the current or something is wrong with my water I think...


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## JTang (Apr 21, 2010)

Well my 120 gal is turning 3 yrs old in couple of weeks n so far Im still sticking with the term, "Bright Side". Lol

I have a similar low budget setup as yours. Mine is a 46 gal Bow front. Sumpless, cheap Coralife PC light, Remora Aqua C Skimmer. No dosing, reactors or ato...

I had tried both HOB and canister and ended up getting raid of both. I almost shut it down due to crazy green hair algae outbreak as the tank turned 1 year old. It might work for you if u can keep up with the frequent (every day or 2) cleaning. As for water flow, I started with two MJ's as well but switched to Koralia when I came across with a great deal. Got them for $10 each. They work way better than than those MJ's like Anthony said. 

Just like my 120g, the liverocks are stacked in the middle of the tank, away from the back n sides (n front of course! Lol). The powerheads are set up on each end of the tank (one in the upper front, the other in the back, pointing slightly downward). Objective is to create a current that circulates around the "island". 

So far this setup has worked good for me, considering this tank is heavily stocked. I'm looking into upgrading to a bigger tank since I just found out that the snowflake eel has grown double its length since I got him. It is at least 2' long now!


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Thanks for all the help, really really appreciate it.
JTang, I have removed the HOB. Thanks for sharing your experience.
I did a 10% water change, and checked my parameters and got ammonia=nitrite=0 and my nitrate is about 5ppm.
My salinity is 1.022-1.023, which is a bit on the low side, is it?
I am only adding instant ocean, 1/2 cup in 1 gallon, should I add something else?
I have 2 fish inside, and they are starting to swim between the rocks a bit. I think they are used to the current or may be they feel better now that the HOB is removed.
Thanks for all the help, Anthony, Albert, JTang, MEDHBSI and MrBob.


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## Nicole (Nov 21, 2011)

Get rid of the MJs as mentioned above. Sure they were cheap but the cost of both of them could have paid of one koralia which is enough.
I have a koralia 3 you could borrow. It's old though so you might have to re-plug it in a few times to get it started. Once going it works fine.

Test the salinity of the water you are mixing before you add it into the tank. I add a bit more than 1/2cup per gallon to get a salinity of 1.025. Are you using a hydrometer? If so try a refractometer for a more accurate reading.

How are the fish doing now? Are they eating okay? Some can hide for weeks until you think they are dead and then they pop up out of nowhere. I think a more gentle water flow will help them adjust. You can try directing the MJs at the rocks so the current flow will be more varied.

I do have a canister running on my tank. It's filled with nothing but live rock. I took all the trays out too. It's unnecessary for you to have one on your tank though. I am just using mine kind of like a sump because I don't have room to put all the rock in my tank.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Nicole said:


> Get rid of the MJs as mentioned above. Sure they were cheap but the cost of both of them could have paid of one koralia which is enough.
> I have a koralia 3 you could borrow. It's old though so you might have to re-plug it in a few times to get it started. Once going it works fine.
> 
> Test the salinity of the water you are mixing before you add it into the tank. I add a bit more than 1/2cup per gallon to get a salinity of 1.025. Are you using a hydrometer? If so try a refractometer for a more accurate reading.
> ...


Thanks Nicole, the fish are doing a bit better, still alive surprisingly... and they are very active during feeding time. It is just that when there is no food they are quite inactive.
My salinity is 1.024 now. I have one of those thing that you read by pointing it at the light, like a telescope. I think it is the device you suggested. 
I am trying to run a XP3 with nothing but seachem matrix (it is like some kind of rocks) mixed with a bit of Eheim sinter glass (from before, but I have rinsed and boiled them) inside now. I am still trying to wrap my mind around this whole new way of keeping fish and it is just weird to think I can do such small water change and still get low nitrate.
I had the pleasure to visit Albert today, he was very patient and took his time to answer my 5000 questions without kicking me out. It was an awesome experience. I also bought 2 starfish looking thingy (it has some black bands, with a fat round body and some tenacles) from him and they are still alive! I can see them moving around when I turn off the light. It is pretty neat.
It is a learning curve for sure, but it is kind of fun.
I may take you up on the offer of the Koralia, thank you so much.
With one powerhead I am just not sure how to set it up to make sure I do not have dead spots. Like the rookie that I am, I stack up a lot of rocks in the tank. LOL
Albert said may be the fish are just nervous because I only have 2 tiny guys inside. I kind of want to have more current to make sure I do not have something rotting on the bottom or inside some cave or something. I will let the tank run for a while before I add any more fish. Right now I change 5 gallon of water a week. I feel guilty doing such small water change, it feels very weird.


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## Nicole (Nov 21, 2011)

Your live rock acts as your filtration device so you shouldn't need the XP3. If you do use it, you will need to clean it regularly or it might become a nitrate factory.


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## albert_dao (May 28, 2012)

He's filling it with Hydroton and ceramics. It won't become a nitrate factory


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Yes, I am, thanks Albert.
Nicole, thanks for your suggestion. I will keep monitoring the nitrate level frequently. So far, I have very little nitrate (under 5ppm) and I am actually thinking of may be I should put a dead shrimp in there or something. I am doing two 10% water change now rather than one per week, and I will service the canister often just to have an idea how long it takes for the flow to decrease and how dirty does it really get. 
I have closely monitoring the flow in the tank, so far, I have not found any dead spot. If anything, the flow might be just a bit strong for the two tiny fish I have.
So far, other than the flow, everything seems to be working quite well. I also noticed some more purple patches on my other live rocks that did not have any of these purple algae before.
I am at this point leaning towards just rocks with no coral. I want to have some cool fish that will interact with me and the family in the tank. 
As I am used to keeping discus with massive water changes, even if I have to do more water changes and keep servicing my filter more than what some may prefer for this saltwater tank, it is not a big deal for me, as it is still less work for me compared to changing 100% water for my discus tank on a daily basis. I am committed to keep everything clean since the beginning because I know once I let it slack things could get bad quickly. 
I am already thinking of getting another saltwater tank which is bigger, this is very bad. LOL.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

I have another question. I keep getting a nitrate around 5ppm. What is the nitrate you guys aim for? Will all the filtration get nitrate to close to zero?
Say, can I use nitrate level to judge when I want to change my water? i.e. change my water whenever my nitrate hits 10ppm or something like that?
What can most fish tolerate?
I am crazy when it comes to keeping my water clean. I have done quite a few water changes already, and changing saltwater water is not really a problem for me. Is more water changes better for saltwater just like it is for fresh water? I am aksing because it seems most slt water people do not change that often, so is it like bad in some way?


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## albert_dao (May 28, 2012)

3-10 ppm is perfectly acceptable for fish and higher is even, in some cases, fine for corals. You will be hard pressed to achieve 0 PPM without utilizing a probiotic method. I wouldn't sweat it if you have no intentions of keeping SPS.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Thanks Albert for the info. 
I will get a better light then contact you for some simple coral. 
My light is really dim and weak right now, it is embarrassing.


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## albert_dao (May 28, 2012)

Heh, sounds good. Next time you're by, LMK and I'll give you a free coral to try out


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## SeaHorse_Fanatic (Apr 22, 2010)

Yes, few tanks will ever stay close to 0ppm for Nitrates. Fish poop and the bacteria convert it to nitrates so its natural to have some. Its mainly when the levels become elevated that nitrates become more of an issue. 5ppm is fine. The ultra low nutrient SPS tanks may achieve the 0ppm but most other reefs will not be that low.

Anthony


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Thanks Albert and Anthony. My hardness is about 8-10, salinity is now around 1.026-1.028, pH is 8.4 or so. Are these parameters okay...
I added a few fish inside, plus a little banded shrimp (my fathers day gift ) and they are eating and all. 
I hope I wont mess things up.


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## albert_dao (May 28, 2012)

You salinity should be around 1.023-1.025 for what you have, so you're a bit high. kH looks good, but it shouldn't be at that level of variance. 8 or 10 is fine, but you should never be seeing a swing to either end day to day or week to week. I'd aim for a swing no greater than 0.25 if possible. To be honest, I haven't tested pH in years.


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## Fish rookie (May 21, 2012)

Thanks Albert. I am still trying to figure out how much to fill up the bucket so I can get the exact salinity and kH every time during water change. Once I have it figured out I will mark my bucket so I do the same everytime.
Thanks for all your help.


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